TEST SITE - DO NOT USE - Development only

My family is very large, my father is the youngest of 11 siblings. his father was born in zacatecas mexico, his name was benjamin. he had a brother named ramerio. I am researching our family but no one seems to know what my grandfathers, fathers name was. I have heard that he was very tall light skined and very strict. it is exciting to find out new information on my heritage. about the people and the many stories I have read. I am very happy to be a member of this group. I have been stuck for a while now on my research, and this gives me a new hope of learning more about my family history.

As I understand the article we are all the children of Moctezuma in the broadest possible interpretation of the term because he has living descendants. Because he is a link in the human chain.

He was descendent from the sole human survivor, as well. It is not necessarily a direct linear descent, but an interconnected relatedness in which every living person on earth shares DNA with each other, and with persons such as Moctezuma, Cortez, the Hapsburgs...

The article went on to describe Brooke Shileds royal descent as an example. As if we really care about her personal lineage!

The author might have had a political agenda. He said every Arab has Jewish relatives, and vice versa. Words close to that, I don't have the article anymore. The analogy could equally be applied to conquistadores, and conquered.

I agree with you about the exceptions regarding the aboriginal people of Austraila, and others. I believe the entire premise is flawed. Yet it is presented as a mathematical certainty without addressing major issues.

It is hard to find. I located a library in Texas with a copy. but they were not willing to let it out of their state on an inter library loan.

But they were kind enough to copy the ten pages of chapter 58, capitulo 58.
The descent of Petronila Moctezuma and Martin Navarro down through both of their daughters.

The chapter corroborates Petronila's descent from the emperor of the Aztecs. Something I've been looking for for years.

I also have Petronila's marriage record as compiled by Jaime Holcombe. Further proof of her imperial descent.

I would be gald to email my scans to you so everyone can view this valuable material.

And, in hopes that others will contribute what they have and know about Petronila Moctezuma.
My cause celebre!

I discovered the El Paso library was set to open this July, but
it's mid-July and nothing yet. Can't seem to contact anyone
either. Will keep you informed.

Connie

Connie Dominguez
El Paso, TX, USA

Never heard of them. Who are they?

My Alderete ancestry is very iffy. My paternal lineage that I uploaded traces back through my gggrandmother Silvestra Romo in Coahuila back to Aguascalientes. Through my father's maternal side.

But my father never knew his dad. I'm trying to verify that line. My father was Ernie Alderete Senior. He told me his dad was Kiko Alderete, a judge in Ysleta Texas.

I found that Kiko recently. And his lineage takes us back to Martin Alderete who was born in Ysleta in 1818, his son Benigno Alderete who was born in the same place around 1847, his son Kiko who was born around the end of the century in Ysleta. And my dad born in Ysleta in 1923.

I recently found who I believe is my father's younger sister. A wonrderdul, loving women who accepted me as her nephew without hesitation, or question. But of course her DNA can't be tested to prove the connection:(

A work in progress. Hopefully, the library in El Paso will reopen sometime this year and I might find some anwers there.

I am researching in Sonora and searching for the elusive TISNADO who
migrated to Sonora from someplace in the seventeenth century.

These websites have been most useful to me and my be of use to someone
who finds themselves reserarching in Northwestern Mexico.

http://www.colson.edu.mx/testamentos/proyecto.html
http://www.nps.gov/tuma/M2000.html
http://www.statemuseum.arizona.edu/oer/index.shtml

George

Hi Rose,

I am researching in Sonora and searching for the elusive TISNADO who
migrated to Sonora from someplace in the seventeenth century.

Try these websites:
http://www.colson.edu.mx/testamentos/proyecto.html
http://www.nps.gov/tuma/M2000.html
http://www.statemuseum.arizona.edu/oer/index.shtml

Be creative with the spelling of Durazzo. I found some possibilies.

Best,
George

Dear Joseph, I don't know if you recall that I had requested to be removed
from the email list. I have limited access to a computer because of where
I live (in the boonies) so when I can check msgs, the mailbox is loaded.
It is too much for me to deal with at this time. Later, when my situation
changes, I'll recontact you. Thank you and I look forward to reconnecting
with this group later.

Margot Shackelford

Original Message:
-----------------
From: Joseph Puentes makas@nc.rr.com
Date: Wed, 05 Jul 2006 15:00:57 -0500
To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] Send In Your Introductions: was-Novice's
1stattempt

thanks Mike for your words and encouragement. There is a lot of
information available for those that seek. . .my meaning is that if you
just joined the list you should consider sending in your Introduction.
Send in your questions and comments, in other words get involved. There
have been many new people join the group in the last few weeks but only
a small percent of you have sent in your introductions. You will only
get something out of this group if you put something into it. We as a
group are here to help you get started. Once you have a "start" you need
to take the bull by the horns and work your own research. In time you
can join the group that shares what they have learned to help others get
their start. We should constantly be nurturing new people to later help
nuture the next wave of new members.

and Mike that excitement you have is what many of us still have when we
discover a new relative. I describe it as my heart doing a back flip!

great going and hope you make many other discoveries!

joseph

Mike Bernard Lopez wrote:

>Dear list,
> Ok, this is way toooo freaky! I posted 4 the 1st time last week with the
encouragement of Alicia Carillo. My Post was in reference to my mother,
Maria de Jesus Bravo & Gparents Ladislao Bravo & Maria Tinoco from La
Ribera Jalisco. Separately & without mention in my post, I have also been
searching (about 2 years) 4 info on my paternal gparents, Bernardino Lopez
& Donaciana Gutierres from Guanajuato. Last evening I received an email
from Erlinda (Linda in BC) providing me listings for them! Yes, that's
excitement you detect in my e-voice! I just wanted to publicly thank
Nuestros Ranchos, Alicia and of course, Linda in BC!
>
> Michael
>
>

Perhps, if you transcribe the Inquisiton document in Spanish here, someone could translate it to English.

Regarding Italians in Mexico, I live in Monterey Park. My city, as well as the adjoining cities of San Gabriel, Rosemead, Commerce, East Los Angeles.... were all granted by the King of Spain to an Italian gentleman.

There's a few streets named after him, El Repetto being the major one. I think his name was Alessandro Repetto.

Monterey Park was orignally called Ramona Acres, named after the mythical Mexican maiden.

I believe there's an annual pageant dedicated to her, but not in this immediate area.

My city was envisioned as the new Santa Barbara. All buildings were to be built in the Spanish style, with red clay tile roofs.

But a Chinese majority moved in, and completely reversed all the ordinances.
The English-only initiative in California began in my city as a reaction to signage only in Chinese.

I recieved an e-mail from Gary Felix about my Y-DNA findings of Haplogroup N for my Gutierrez line. I was not correct on the information on the Haplogroup N report for my Gutierrez line. 80% of Chinese are Haplogroup O, a offshoot of Haplogroup N so the odds of our line being Chinese are very slim.. Gary said that the odds are my Gutierrez line are Native American originally from Siberia and Russia by way of China.. They would have immigrated abt 15,000 years ago so any trace's of the Asian features would not really apply to us.. So, I guess we got our slanted eyes from our Indio ancestor's after all... (I kinda liked being Chinese)... oh well, back to the drawing board..

Sorry for the confusion and it has been fun!
Linda in B.C.

---------------------------------
Do you Yahoo!?
Get on board. You're invited to try the new Yahoo! Mail Beta.

Has anyone heard or seen this book? Has anyone used such publications for genealogical research?

Author: Otte, Enrique
Title: Cartas Privadas de Emigrantes a Indias, 1540-1616

Linda and I have uploaded her genealogy into the searchable GEDCOM database. Her information is also available in her Members' Genealogy folder.

You can view her information by clicking on "GEDCOM" from the main menu and then selecting "Surnames" for a surname listing and selecting her tree "Romero, Linda Ancestors" from the pull down menu labeled "Tree".

Here is the reply I got from my Family History Center manager:

> ps: is that 800 number to the LDS church in SLC available to the
> public? Can I hand it out to the genealogy group i have so they can
> contact the "international" desk for occassional questions?
>
Yes, anybody is welcome to use it. This might be a newer number:
866-406-1830

==========

If you have specific questions that you can't otherwise find on the
www.familysearch.org site call the above number and ask for the
"International" desk or area for Mexico. Please share what you find with
the group.

joseph

I received the following second message from SLC FHC - It still doesn't
explain why this IGI had only the batch number. I continue to agree with
Rose, that while additions or corrections are in the process of being made,
an IGI will only reflect a batch number. Once completed, then a batch
number will be assigned with either "M" "C" "J" and "K" along with dates
and a film number. Pat

Dear Patricia J. Silva Corbera,

We appreciate your inquiry and apologize as w egave you the wrong film
number. The correct number is 245201 Registros parroquiales, 1881-1933
Iglesia Católica. Jesús (Zacatecas, Zacatecas) Bautismos 1884-1890

To find this in our catalog go to www.FamilySearch.org, click on "Film/Fiche
search" and type in the number. Click on the title that comes up and then on
the "View Film Notes" tab. This will get you the entire series.

We hope this information is helpful and wish you success in your research.

Sincerely,

Family History Research Support
familyhistory@support.familysearch.org

FCH/vla

http://www.allbusiness.com/periodicals/article/562769-1.html

Joseph,

Above is a link to a great article on one of your relatives that apparently inherited the Puentes Bros business now headquartered in Salem, Oregon. I tried to copy the article and send it to Ranchos, but you have to register for a password in order to read the entire article (four pages).

I didn't realize that the Don Pancho's brand (Puentes Brothers Inc.) is named after Francisco Puentes (your last surviving uncle?).

In the article, the executive VP, Ricardo Baez, says that the business expanded across Oregon and Washington as a growing number of Hispanics moved into the region because the cost of living is so much more affordable---than it is in other parts along the West Coast.

"A lot of Hispanics over the years have been priced out of the market in California," Baes says. "What they did was they sold their houses down there because they couldn't believe the quality of life up here". [That's what we did!]

The article states that the company is still run by Don Pancho's son George Puentes, the company president, with Phillip Puentes, VP of operations, Frank Puentes, warehouse manager, and Baez, their brother-in-law, heading up sales and marketing. The company has expanded into more than tortillas; they produce flavored wraps, low-carb wraps, low-fat wraps, gluten-free wraps, tortilla chips, un-fried tortilla chips, tostadas and taco shells. The company also mixes its own spices, produces its own custom tortilla mixes and sells imported Mexican cheeses, and can even provide chorizo. The business has diversified and expanded up to Canada, and west to Idaho, Montana, Utah, the Dakotas, and the Midwest. "Twenty-five years ago, it wasn't fashionable for grocery stores or food distributors to offer Mexican food items. Now it's the trendy thing to do." Also, the Salem, Oregon plant has been certified organic. [Way to go!] Production is now computerized around the clock in Sal
em, Salt
Lake City, and Yakima, and they have huge warehouses, silos, plants, truck bays, semis, and their own rail spurs for prompt delivery of fresh ingredients.

The rest of the article goes into a description of the production, which to me was interesting, since I love tortillas: flour and corn lines, fryers, mixers, dusters, proofers, presses, ovens, elevators, chutes, coolers, accumulators, sealers, bar coders, case packagers and metal detectors (all state-of-the art). Tortillas are produced at the rate of 3,500 an hour, and the plants have earned a superior rating from the American Institute of Baking, and have on-site full-scale quality assurance labs. As Mexicans we can be proud of what some of our own have accomplished.

See what your Dad and his brothers started, Joseph? By the way, is there still a Puentes Brothers store in San Jose, or has it all gone big business?

Emilie Garcia
Port Orchard, WA --

When I stayed in a small town in Coahuila as a young teenager, this was the
highlight of pre-determined evenings. We would all dress up, head towards
the plaza with the elders and begin walking (in one direction), while the guys
walked in another direction. The elders sat in the peripherals of the plaza,
catching up on gossip, politics, while keeping a watchful eye on all of us.

The funny part of this tradition was I remember a really cute guy had
"ojitos" for me, and when we returned back home, I was excited, like every 15 year
old would be. But then, my aunts promptly told that he was a 2nd cousin -
and therefore it was totally unacceptable to give "ojitos" back. In reality,
everyone was related to me - so this tradition was not very productive for my
cousins....

I guess that is why there were "fiestas", to encourage other towns to visit
your town and to participate in these rituals and get the blood lines
somewhat mixed.....that is how many of my cousins all met their spouses.

Mexican women also immigated to China to marry Chinese men.
At least that was the story my mother told me. She said the prospective brides were led to believe they would live a certain way, but that many wound up as concubines, or worse.

Supposedly, average Mexicans raised millions of silver pesos to repatriate the women who arrived in Acapulco in ships with stories to tell.

Pancho Villa was notorious for his anti-Chinese fervor. I've heard he executed all Chinese in his territory.

When I was in Hong Kong and Macau I saw many Mexican pesos with "chop" marks. The Chinese, as well as Persians, Arabs and many other people in Asia and Africa used the peso as their currency.

They hammered into the coins chop marks, incised markings to indicate they were currency in their particular jurisdiction.

Around 1905 Mexico changed the legend on its coins to "Estados Unidos Mexicanos.," and switched to the current peso.

But people all over the world believed "Republica Mexicana" meant pure silver. So Mexico continued, still continues, to issue Ocho Reales silver coins labeled Republica Mexicana for export with the date 1898.

Many people use the silver Ocho Reales for body adornment. Necklaces of money, such as they wear in Burma, and Thailand. It's their form of savings.

I have just posted a picture of a church in the Albums/Ranchos y Ciudades/Nochistlan, Zacatecas section. I received this photo from a primo about a year ago and have since lost contact with him. Does anyone recognize this church, and/or know it's name. According to my primo this is where my great-grandparents, Victo Jauregui and Petra Huerta, were married in Nochistlan, Zac.

Olivia,
Rowland Heights, CA

Malaga, Spain, Tino and I vacationed there years ago, just down from
> Torremolinos. It's a beautiful area of Spain. I don't recall
> Benalmadena,
> nor the feria being mentioned. We were there August 1989.
> Thank you for sharing and rekindling both the good and the not so good
> times, what I often refer to as life's "emotional roller coaster."
>
> Pat
>

Pat and Nuestros Ranchos;

Here is the link to the Benalmadena calendar of events of Malaga España in case anyone is interested. http://www.andalucia.com/calendar/benalmadena.htm

It makes me want to hop on a plane to one of these festivals.

The month of June reminds me of la Fiesta de San Agustin in my pueblo of Tlachichila Zacatecas. During the two week celebration every night the singles in the town gather in the evenings around La Plaza. The females walk or strut around the courtyard in one direction to the tune of the music and the males march in the opposite direction also around the courtyard or plaza. The males come prepared with fresh flowers and when they see a female that particularly catches their eye they will hand her a flower as they pass, this is how she knows that he is interested in her. If at the next passing she is interested in him she will accept another flower, otherwise she will just pass him by. If he is very intersted and she does not respond and if he's persistent, he will begin to throw flowers in her direction. Mom and dad used to talk about this and I did not really believe it was still going on. Guess what? It is and it is a beautiful but provincial ritual or tradition.

Alicia

Barron certainly appears to be a common name in Mexico for some time so the England story is suspect.

Here are a couple of IGI listings that look somewhat interesting as far as Rosario's parents though neither is an exact match. I suppose Rosario died to early to be listed in the Social Security death index. Do you have any idea which border crossing he would have used to come to the U.S.?

HILARIO BARRON
Marriages:
Spouse: PRISCILIANA FERNANDEZ
Marriage: 16 OCT 1879
Nuestra Senora Del Refugio, Ciudad Victoria, Tamaulipas, Mexico
Husband Age at Marriage: 35
Wife Age at Marriage: 20
Batch M601749 Film 0639882

Sabas Barron
Parents:
Father: Feliciano Barron
Mother: Catalina Muños
Marriages:
Spouse: Priciliana Benavides
Marriage: 16 SEP 1883
Santa Maria La Redonda,Guerrero, , Distrito Federal, Mexico

Batch M619093 Film 0036169

=====================
From: Pat Silva Corbera
Date: 2006/07/13 Thu AM 10:40:09 CDT
To: research@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] Quic-Silver Mining Almanden / San Jose /Santa Clara Co CA.

My son-in-law's paternal maternal great-grandfather, Rosario Barron (Paura) worked the Quik Silver Mines in what was known as the Redwood Township Almaden Precinct of Santa Clara Co. CA. in the 1920s.

Rosario Barron b. abt 1884 Mexico, died bef 1930, son of (father's name not known to me) and mother Preciliana Paura b. abt 1860. Rosario married Macaria Perales Rodriquez, she b. 24 March 1889 Jesus, Zacatecas, Mexico daughter of Luis Perales and Victoriana Rodriquez. Verbal history has Rosario being born in England, and traveling to Mexico in the late 1800s. The 1920 Santa Clara Co. Federal Census indicates that he was born in Mexico, as were his parents.

1920 Santa Clara Co. CA Census, Sosario (Rosario) Barron head of household, Macaria wife; sons Marcello, Cipriano, Tomas, Manuel and daughter Natalia, also listed is Preciliana Paura (Rosario's widowed mother); Emilio Perales (Rosario's brother-in-law) and Victoriana Rodriquez (Rosario's widowed mother-in-law.)

On the 1930 Santa Clara Co. CA census Macaria is listed as a male/head of household, along with children Sipriano, Natalie, Thomas, Manuel, Albert, Alexandria and Emilio; and mother Victoria Perales. One can only assume that from 1920 to 1930 Rosario Barron and his mother Preciliana Paura had passed away.

Pat Silva Corbera

Long before I became interested in genealogy, I was aware of family lore
that there was a Chinese ancestor in my maternal family. In the 1980s I
determined to resolve the issue. As such, I visited the FHC in Yuma, AZ and
began my journey: the more microfilm I read, the more I ordered. Finally, I
found my gr gr grandfather's "diligencia matrimonial" in which he stated the
name of his parents, his age and place of birth. Based on the age of my gr
gr grandfather, I proceeded to order the appropriate baptismal and
matrimonial microfilms for Hermosillo, Sonora..

I soon found a matrimonial entry for Juan José Manuel Concepción and María
Leocádia Munguía in the Capilla of the Real Presidio de Pitic (now
Hermosillo, Sonora) on May 28, 1821. Interesting he stated he was born in
Macao, in the Chinese Empire and the name of the bride was that of my gr gr
gr grandmother. However, it was not until I found the baptismal entries of
his sons, that I realized my ancestor had changed his name to Juan Bon.

Now, I hope to find my Tisnado ancestor in the 1600s.

George

My son-in-law's paternal maternal great-grandfather, Rosario Barron (Paura) worked the Quik Silver Mines in what was known as the Redwood Township Almaden Precinct of Santa Clara Co. CA. in the 1920s.

Rosario Barron b. abt 1884 Mexico, died bef 1930, son of (father's name not known to me) and mother Preciliana Paura b. abt 1860. Rosario married Macaria Perales Rodriquez, she b. 24 March 1889 Jesus, Zacatecas, Mexico daughter of Luis Perales and Victoriana Rodriquez. Verbal history has Rosario being born in England, and traveling to Mexico in the late 1800s. The 1920 Santa Clara Co. Federal Census indicates that he was born in Mexico, as were his parents.

1920 Santa Clara Co. CA Census, Sosario (Rosario) Barron head of household, Macaria wife; sons Marcello, Cipriano, Tomas, Manuel and daughter Natalia, also listed is Preciliana Paura (Rosario's widowed mother); Emilio Perales (Rosario's brother-in-law) and Victoriana Rodriquez (Rosario's widowed mother-in-law.)

On the 1930 Santa Clara Co. CA census Macaria is listed as a male/head of household, along with children Sipriano, Natalie, Thomas, Manuel, Albert, Alexandria and Emilio; and mother Victoria Perales. One can only assume that from 1920 to 1930 Rosario Barron and his mother Preciliana Paura had passed away.

Pat Silva Corbera

What a small world, My parents owned the Warburton's Tamales and Enchilada Shop in Santa Clara and bought about 500 tortillas weekly from Puentes Bros. They used to make their own tortillas while the shop was in Santa Clara, but when they bought a restaurant in Mountain View, they took to buying their tortillas from Puentes Bros. That would have been the mid 50s. I just talked to my Mom and she remembers either your Mother or Aunt's birthday being on St. Patrick's Day. My brother took over the Tamale business in the early 80's and I am not sure where he was buying the tortillas then. Warburton's is now closed but my twin and I still get together and make the tamales and enchiladas. To celebrate the business's 100th anniversary, in 2004, Mom gave out the recipe to all our cousins. My parents were Bud and Aileen Chiono in case your family remembers them.

Kitty Chiono Cortez
Rocklin, CA

A couple of people have asked me about Indian kidnappings, and life on the unsettled frontier in general.

Of course, I don't mean to demonize the Indians who were only protecting their families, homes, and land. But the story is almost always told from the European perspective.

I came across these notes in my Romo Famiy files that I had forgotten about. They are oral traditions written down as best remembered.

Isidoro was the grandson of Isidoro Palos, who family history claims came from Palos, Spain circa 1820 as a student. Isidoro the first was involved in student unrest (participated in the Mexican revolution against Spain), and was jailed. Legend has it that he was in leg irons and only escaped when an Indian woman smuggled a knife in, and he cut off his own heel.

Mama Tencha says that Isidoro's dad's family (Blas), raised a young man who was Mexican but had been taken by Indians when the boy was a very young boy. This young man later returned to civilization and taught Isidoro many things about plants and wild life, having learned these things from the Indians. Isidoro used to tell Mama that when he was a boy, his young man took him to the forest or wilderness and proceeded to make Isidoro first smell a plant that caused a severe nosebleed, and then making him smell another plant that stopped the bleeding instantly.

Isidoro used to tell Mom stories about his youth, when they would bring cotton to the gins in San Antonio, Tx from Mexico. At that time, they still had to come in wagon trains because of Indian attacks.

Note: I assume they are refering to Apaches in Coahuila.

Not a real big deal now but lets try to keep the messages on the right
lists:

for things directly related to research use: research@nuestrosranchos.org

for things of a general nature use: general@nuestrosranchos.org

for things that are announcements use: announce@nuestrosranchos.org

like I said it is not a big deal just a very gentle reminder to lets try
to keep the messages going to the right list.

thanks,

joseph

ps: while I'm at it. Have you all gone in and updated your profiles? If
not log in and go to "My Account" and then the "Edit" tab and completely
as possible (please don't skimp) update your "Personal Information" and
"Research" information. Also while you are there you can change from
individual emails to digest if the list is becomeing to much for your
inbox OR if you really want you can change to "no mail" and not receive
the mail to your inbox at all but will have to read the emails online at
http://nuestrosranchos.org