TEST SITE - DO NOT USE - Development only

I'm also a coin collector (mostly US coins). I have a few thousand coins that I collected in the 1950s and 1960s. Most are AU or XF condition. Some are very rare and very valuable.

My prize coin was given to me a few years ago. It's a silver peso from Mexico. It is almost uncirculated. It was minted in 1944, the year of my birth in Mexico.

Jose Carlos de Leon

EMAILING FOR THE GREATER GOOD
Join me

> Date: Mon, 7 Sep 2009 21:27:56 -0400
> From: makas@nc.rr.com
> To: general@nuestrosranchos.org
> Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] 8 Real Coins
>
>
> I have some significant happenings in my family in 1793 with my GGGG
> grandparents Justo Puente and Josefa Sanchez being married in Sombrerete
> and also my twin GGG grandfathers both named Jose Tadeo Diaz being born
> in Sauz de Los Marquez. So awhile back I went to the local Coin store
> and had the guy go to the next coin show and purchase me a 1/2 real very
> small silver coin dating 1793 for $30. Unfortunately

Coins from Colonial Mexico circulated widely in the English colonies in North America, and in fact were common in the early days of the United States. In fact, they circulated widely throughout the world.

The 8 reales silver coin is the size of the old silver dollars, and when in one of the better grades is quite striking! This coin is also called the Spanish Milled Dollar, or a Piece of Eight. Thomas Jefferson recommended to the Continental Congress in 1776 that it be adopted as the official currency of the new United States.

The 8 reales coin was divided into 8 parts or bits. Two bits was equal to to 25 cents in the US (remember the old rhyme ... 2 bits, 4 bits, 6 bits, a dollar?).

The Mexico city mint mark is an M with a little circle over it. These same coins were also minted in Bolivia, Chile, Colombia, Guatemala and Peru; these will be identified by different mint marks.

Earlier coins exist from the 1500s; these are irregular in shape and are referred to as "cobs." These are

This is just to expand on previous comments.

According to DICCIONARIO PANHISPÁNICO DE DUDAS - Primera edición (octubre 2005) from the Real Academia Española that during the Middle Ages the X was pronounced similar the current way of sh in English and the ch in French.
http://buscon.rae.es/dpdI/SrvltGUIBusDPD?lema=x

Although Antonio de Nebrija, the author of la primera gramática española (1492), wrote "La x, ya dijimos qué son tiene en el latín, y que no es otra cosa sino breviatura de cs; nosotros dámosle tal pronunciación, cual suena en las primeras letras de estas dicciones: xenabe, xabón, o en las últimas de aquestas: relox, balax; mucho contra su naturaleza, porque esta pronunciación, como dijimos, es propia de la lengua arábiga, de donde parece que vino a nuestro lenguaje."
http://www.antoniodenebrija.org/libro1.html#5

The Real Academia Española also asks for the world to respect México and to spell it's name and other similar names to be spelled in this way.
http://buscon.rae

To Arturo:

The use of the letter "x" in Spanish is one of the strongest indicators of an Arabic influence in the language. At some point the Academia Real decided that the sound represented by the "x" wasn't acceptable anymore. I no longer remember which edition of their dictionary enunciates the change. The decision to keep the "x" in the Spanish of the Americas was made at the time the nations of the western hemisphere broke away from Spanish political control.

The sound in Arabic is made by bending back the tongue and vibrating the back part of the velum in the buccal cavity at the same time forcing air into the pharyngeal area. What actually occurred is that the sounds of Spanish have become more oral and less guttural. When the christians arrived in the western hemisphere the almost 100% phonetic ability of 6th century Spanish came in handy. Spanish succeeded in graphically representing virtually every sound they heard in the languages of the newly discovered indigenes.

I was raised spelling Mexico as Méjico. I asked this along time ago. Maybe its because

my parents are alteños. According to my grandfather (I try to paraphrase as best as I remember!)

I guess in Old Castilian the X was used for J, since the letter didnt exist but the sound did.

So the X made the J sound. When the conquistadores came they learned the people were

Mexica (Mesheeca) so they gave it a more Europeanized name, Mexico (except the X stood for sounds that didnt exist in Castilian, ie. SH. During the colony it was actually still pronounced Meshico, except it had the Castilian Whistle not actually SH like in English. When more Europeans were deciding where to go in America, thye would prob ask "Por que no vamos a Mexico (Mesico) (whistle). But at the same Mexico was really used. Mexico being Spain's principal colony usually was just reffered as New Spain, it was common usage. Then or eventually in the early colony the X slowly changed to the J and K sound. I guess there

GRACIAS SALVADOR, COMPLEMENTAS LO QUE YA TENGO Y SE VUELVE MAS COMPLETO,
ESTO ME AYUDARA MAS CON EL TRABAJO

2009/9/5

> IGI Individual Record FamilySearch™ International Genealogical Index v5.0
> Mexico Search Results | Download | Print
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> ANTONIO LEONICIO CABRAL Pedigree Male Family
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Event(s): Birth: Christening: Death: Burial:
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Marriages: Spouse: ANNA DE SANTIAGO Family Marriage: 10 FEB 1777
> Huejucar, Jalisco, Mexico
>
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Messages: Extracted marriage record for locality listed in the record. The
> source records are usually arranged chronologically by the marriage date.
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------

Sandra I've never used this film series but just putting the information
out in case you want to have a look at one of there films and report
back to the group about the type of information found within:

Title
Documentos eclesiásticos, 1604-1898

Authors
Iglesia Católica. Diócesis de Guadalajara (México) (Main Author)

Notes
Microfilme de manuscritos en el Archivo de la Sagrada Mitra en Guadalajara.
Ordenes de los ingresos al sacerdocio.
Documents regarding ordinations to the priesthood within the Roman
Catholic Diocese of Guadalajara, Jalisco, Mexico.

Subjects
México, Jalisco - Church records
México, Jalisco, Guadalajara - Church records

Format
Manuscript (On Film)

Language
Spanish

Publication
Salt Lake City, Utah : Filmados por la Sociedad Genealógica de Utah,
1957-1958

Physical
131 carretes de microfilme ; 35 mm.

Film Notes
Note - Location [Film]
Ordenes 1648-1881 - VAULT INTL Film [ 168673 ]
Ordenes 1600-1699 - FHL INTL Film [ 168674 ]
Ordenes 1600-1628, 1714 - VAULT

Hi Esther,
Can you check for the PAULINO SEVILLA married to HEXIQUIA MORGUTIA. Both are my grandparents.  I don't know where exactly they were born. To my understanding they may have been born in Santa Catarina Jalisco (AKA General Andres Figueroa) or Zacoalco de Torres, but they could have born anywhere.

I known that many SEVILLA'S were born in Zacoalco and the sorrounding localities, but I have not been able to trace further back than my grandfather Paulino Sevilla.

I know that his name appears in the 1930 census. That's all I know.
Thanks Francisco

--- On Fri, 9/4/09, Esther wrote:

From: Esther
Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] FW: 1930 Census for Jalisco
To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
Date: Friday, September 4, 2009, 4:01 PM

 Hi everyone,

We have started indexing for the State of Jalisco, starting with Acatlan de Juarez, specifically Los Pozos.  If anyone would like me to look out for names from this location please get back to me.  I can only download 5 badges at a time, as I

Hi Rose,

An explanation is in the first few pages of the Record Book of Informaciones Matrimoniales (No. 54/55). The title on pg. 1 (Image 2 of 432) reads as follows:

"Año de 1739
Autos sobre la dotación de las huérfanas que fundó para esta Villa de Aguas Calientes, la de Lagos, y Real de los Asientos, Don Ylario González.
Superintendente de ellas y demás Dotaciones Piadosas el Dr. D. Manuel Colón de Larreategui, Cura Beneficiado y Vicario Juez Eclesiástico de dicha Villa"

The freelance translation of this title is as follows:

"Year of 1739
"Proceedings about the endowment for orphans founded for the town of Aguas Calientes, and those of Lagos and the Real de los Asientos by Mr. Ylario González.
The Superintendent of these and other pious causes Dr. Don Manuel Colón de Larreategui, Clergyman and Vicar, Judge of Ecclesiastical Affairs of said village."

The introduction explains that Mr. Ylario González, obviously a wealthy man, left a substantial amount of money for charity and

Hi Rose,

I took a peek at these records and I think they might be referring to young
women that entered a religious order -

"para ser admitida al (Sorteo)..." means to be admitted to something
"las pobres guerfanas se sorten en la Parrochial deste Real, siendo una
pobre guerfana con las calidadades que dicha obra pia pide...." here it goes
on to say that poor orphan girls with the necessary qualities can sign up
(sorten) at the church.

These frases were repeated in almost all the records I looked at. These are
definitely not baptimal or marriage records - the only thing I can think of
is that these women were to become nuns.

I'll keep reading - maybe there are more clues

-Angelina-

For your parents and probably grandparents birth records of Matanzas you probably need to go to Ojuelos de Jalisco, or find someone that will go for you, to request a copy of the birth certificate. Or you can wait until records show up on pilot.familysearch.org

If you have a relative or friend in Mexico that has Telmex they should be able to access the white pages online for Tamaulipas using their account. I don't know how else you would find a phone book for those towns unless you went there yourself.

Armando

I'm not sure I'm understanding your question but it sounds like you are
looking for living relatives and or their children. One way is to get a
phone book from that area of Mexico and specifically that city and then
call all the Cortez Alvarado's first then if you have a good calling
plan for inexpensive calls to Mexico (try http://stiphonecard.com/ I
have found them very cheap) try calling every Cortez in that city giving
much information about you and finally asking if their Cortez might be
the same Cortez.

just an idea for searching for living relatives.

joseph

======================

Joseph Puentes
NoMeat@h2opodcast.com
http://h2opodcast.com/vsse.html (Vegan Environmental Solutions Podcast)
http://h2opodcast.com (Environmental Podcast)
http://h2opodcast.blogspot.com (Blog for above)
http://PleaseListenToYourMom.com (Women's Peace Podcast)
http://NuestraFamiliaUnida.com (Latin American History Podcast)
http://nuestrosranchos.org (Jalisco, Zacatecas, and Aguascalientes

To Evelyn,

In addition to what Arturo said you should consider the following. Cabillo may also be "Calvillo, Calbillo, Cavillo" and probably other ways of phonetically spelling that surname. Good luck!

David from Albany, CA

-----Original Message-----
>From: ej1357@gmail.com
>Sent: Sep 3, 2009 10:13 AM
>To: research@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
>Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] Carlos C. Gutierrez 1902-1959
>
>I am so excited to find this group. Reading the other posts gives me hope. I've run into a dead end at the border for Carlos...
>
>I'm looking for Carlos C. GUTIERREZ from the time he crossed into the USA and earlier. He stated in his naturalization papers (1954) that he immigrated and stayed in the USA continuously from 2 Jul 1926 and crossed at El Paso, Texas "on the El Paso Electric Co." He also stated that he was born 4 Nov 1902 in Union, Jalisco, Mexico.
>
>On the death records for Carlos, it states his parents were Lorenzo GUTIERREZ and Emilia CABILLO.
>
>I would be

Evelyn:

Welcome to the group. To begin with, the name CABILLO seems a bit awry. You have to take into account people's lack of literacy and often confusion of record keepers... so given the strange name I would consider other similar names such as CARRILLO or CABELLO in your searches. Also, there is no single "Union" in Jalisco, but rather a number of different Uniones:

Union de Guadalupe (Atoyac)
Union de San Antonio
Union de Tula

Now, there are a number of sources worth looking into to try to get more information:

Mexico Border Crossing Records, searchable on Ancestry.com
(His border crossing might have more information or more correct information than his naturalization record)

Mexico 1930 Census available on pilot.familysearch.org
(He may not be there but his parents and siblings might still be. This is not searchable for Jalisco yet, but you can browse the images for the three Uniones in question, though that may be too time consuming without having more information

Joseph,

Can anyone go on this trip? or do you need to be a member of SAR? I am definitely interested but don't want to get too excited. Please advise if this is for information only, or if it's information for those who might have an interest in this trip.

Saludos desde San Jose, Calif

Alicia

________________________________
From: Joseph Puentes
To: general@nuestrosranchos.org; Ciudad_Juarez@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Friday, August 28, 2009 2:06:10 PM
Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] Spain and the American Revolution Travel Tour to Spain and . . .

from Judge58@aol.com

Dear TCARA members,

The SAR cordially invites you to participate in our trip to Spain to honor Spain's assistance during the American Revolutionary War. We're meeting the King of Spain and conducting a Charter celebration for the new SAR Society in Spain. We're paying homage to Gen. Bernardo Galvez in his home town, and at the Malaga Cathedral, where he was successful in obtaining the money they had saved up to build the

Arturo

I noticed the listing on the side for books at Amazon....I have several...under Rosanne Gonzales-Hardy. Was that something that just popped up?

Thanks
Rose

Linda en esas fechas tengo ancestros perdidos
me puedes facilitar una copia
SALVADOR CABRAL VALDES

Linda,
I don't have any research to do in Jerez, but I wanted to say that your offer is very generous.? That was a lot of work and I am grateful that there are many who will benefit from it.?
Eloise Reyes

-----Original Message-----
From: longsjourney@yahoo.com
To: research@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
Sent: Sat, 16 May 2009 4:16 pm
Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] Jerez Zacatecas research

I've completed transcribing 0439852 Jerez baptism records for the years 1867-1869. If you would like an attachment please let me know. I'm happy to share.?
Linda in Everett?

Hi Linda:

Could you please include me in your mailing list for the baptism records of
Jerez?
Thank you

John Gonzalez
1gnzlz@verizon.net

========================================================================================

----- Original Message -----
From:
To:
Sent: Saturday, May 16, 2009 16:16
Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] Jerez Zacatecas research

>
> I've completed transcribing 0439852 Jerez baptism records for the years
> 1867-1869. If you would like an attachment please let me know. I'm happy
> to share.
> Linda in Everett

Hi Linda ,

My name is Welester G. Alvarado if there are any Alvarados´ or Lunas´ in those records and if you don´t mind I would like an attachement as well .

Thank you ,

Welester

> To: research@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
> From: longsjourney@yahoo.com
> Date: Sat, 16 May 2009 16:16:42 -0700
> Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] Jerez Zacatecas research
>
>
> I've completed transcribing 0439852 Jerez baptism records for the years 1867-1869. If you would like an attachment please let me know. I'm happy to share.
> Linda in Everett

Linda..can you send a copy to me? RaulV1@Prodigy.net

--- On Sat, 5/16/09, longsjourney@yahoo.com wrote:

From: longsjourney@yahoo.com
Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] Jerez Zacatecas research
To: research@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
Date: Saturday, May 16, 2009, 4:16 PM

I've completed transcribing 0439852 Jerez baptism records for the years
1867-1869. If you would like an attachment please let me know. I'm happy
to share.
Linda in Everett

Hola yo tengo algunas personas que se apellidan de la torre en Tepatitlan Jose Gutierrez de la Torre. hijo de calixto Gutierrez y Feliciana de la Torre.

casado con Virginia Gutierrez Gonzalez en 26 nov 1897 en Tepatitlan . por si te sirve y algunos otros de Apellido De la Torre.
----- Original Message -----
From: "ENRIQUE DE LA TORRE"
To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 5:19:46 PM GMT -07:00 US/Canada Mountain
Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] acentros

apellidos de la torre, en jalisco, tepa, guadalajara. y poncitlan

Joseph, did you also get an urgent message saying it was from Patricia?

-----Mensaje original-----
De: general-bounces@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
[mailto:general-bounces@lists.nuestrosranchos.org] En nombre de Joseph
Puentes
Enviado el: martes, 01 de septiembre de 2009 05:27 AM
Para: general@nuestrosranchos.org
Asunto: [Nuestros Ranchos] Contacting Patricia Burton

I am trying to contact Patricia Burton. Does anyone know of a way to
contact Patrica Burton other than her group subscription address:
canprin@yahoo.com

if so please email me directly at joseph@nuestrosranchos.org with this
information. It is very important that I contact Patricia Burton right away.

joseph

======================

Joseph Puentes
NoMeat@h2opodcast.com
http://h2opodcast.com/vsse.html (Vegan Environmental Solutions Podcast)
http://h2opodcast.com (Environmental Podcast)
http://h2opodcast.blogspot.com (Blog for above)
http://PleaseListenToYourMom.com (Women's Peace Podcast)
http://NuestraFamiliaUnida.com

Joseph, I have several ways of contacting her. I am her friend and companion at the FHC in Bonita, so let me try calling her since I am closer. I will then get back to you. Since it is 5:30 a.m. here in Chula Vista, I think it is wise I wait for a couple of hours before I call her.

-Esther

I am trying to contact Patricia Burton. Does anyone know of a way to
contact Patrica Burton other than her group subscription address:
canprin@yahoo.com

if so please email me directly at joseph@nuestrosranchos.org with this
information. It is very important that I contact Patricia Burton right away.

joseph

======================

Joseph Puentes
NoMeat@h2opodcast.com
http://h2opodcast.com/vsse.html (Vegan Environmental Solutions Podcast)
http://h2opodcast.com (Environmental Podcast)
http://h2opodcast.blogspot.com (Blog for above)
http://PleaseListenToYourMom.com (Women's Peace Podcast)
http://NuestraFamiliaUnida.com (Latin American History Podcast)
http://nuestrosranchos.org (Jalisco

Please excuse the Spanish, I am using an online translator.

What year was Clemente born? Did he have a daughter or sister named Juliana De La Torre? Juliana had a son in Tepatitlan 1852 and named him Clemente.

Por favor, disculpe los españoles, estoy utilizando un traductor en línea. ¿Qué año nació Clemente? ¿Él tiene una hija o hermana denominado Juliana De La Torre? Juliana tuvo un hijo en 1852 Tepatitlan y lo nombró Clemente.

Maureen Bejar

HOLA YO TAMBIEN SOY DECENDIENTE DE CLEMENTE Y CATALINA TENGO ALGO DE INFORMACION, TIENES EL INFORMACION  DE TU ABUELO COMO PADRES O ALGUNA FECHA, LUGAR DE NACIMIENTO?
SI EN ALGO TE PUEDO AYUDAR CON GUSTO,
UN SALUDO, PRIMO.
LUIS M GONZALEZ.

________________________________
From: "gallerodlt@yahoo.com"
To: general@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 7:33:45 PM
Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] acentros

mis abuelos eran decendientes de Clemente de la torre y Catalina Franco de la cueva
de tepatitlan jalisco, hermano de mi abuelo,ese llamaba cleofas de la torre navarro

I would like to know if anyone had seen the program also. I participated in the project.

Rose
Fresno

Eric,
Thank you so much for your kind offer to help. Yes, you're absolutely right about the miss-spellings. It's a minor miracle I found my mother Enedina Onate, as she was entered as Pardina! I have Onate crossings at Laredo, TX from 1917 to 1944 en route to San Antonio, and they rendered some good information. I was hoping to search two other border crossing towns Del Rio, TX and Eagle Pass, TX within the time frame of 1910-1940. Unfortunately, all I can give you are the first names of my Onates: Rosalio, Petra, Adolfo, Leonarda, Luis, and Maria Angela. I will totally understand if the information I'm giving you is to too vague. Thanks again for your generous offer and have a good evening.
Alice Blake

--- noblanktree@gmail.com wrote:

From: eric edgar
To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Border Crossings
Date: Sat, 22 Aug 2009 21:38:37 -0700

Alice,

Outside of a trip to a NARA archives and browsing miles of Microfilm,
Ancestry is the

Dear Group,
Is Ancestry.com the only way to access US/MX Border Crossing information? I've never subscribed to or had a trial subscription to Ancestry.com, but a couple of years ago my local FHC had access. They have now dropped the subscription. Thanks so much for your help. Alice Blake

Enrique:

Puedes buscar archivos a traves de los numeros de batch en la base de datos genealogica de la Iglesia Mormona en http://www.familysearch.org.

Si quieres ver la partida original a traves de su microfilmacion, puedes pedir el rollo a traves de un centro de historia familiar de la Iglesia Mormona. Las direcciones de esos centros las puedes encontrar en el mismo sitio. Las mas cercana a ti en Culiacan serian:

Culiacán México
Blvd. Lucernilla #1064
Fracc. Nuevo Culiacan
Culiacan, Sinaloa, Mexico
Phone: 52-667-761-0253

Culiacán México Humaya
Rio Mocorito #225 Ote.
Colonia Guadalupe, Fracc. Canacoe
Culiacan, Sinaloa, Mexico

Culiacán México Tamazula
El Dorado #1646
Col. Las Quintas
Culiacan, Sinaloa, Mexico
Phone: 52-667-715-3032

Enrique:

Esta pareja parece haber bautizado por lo menos uno de sus hijos en Yahualica, que no queda muy lejos de Cuquio:

Jose Cayetano Gonzalez b. 9 Agosto 1827, Batch J602352, Rollo 1152476

En esa partida debe dar los nombres de los abuelos del nino, quienes serian los padres de la pareja en cuestion.

Parece haber otras partidas en la misma parroquia de ninos cuyo padre se llamaba Pasqual Perez y cuya madre era Petra Gonzalez. Estos son probablemente los mismos padres, pero viendo la partida y los nombres de los abuelos sabras inmediatamente.

JOSE FAUSTINO PERES GONZALES b. 28 Enero 1831

JOSE JULIAN PERES GONZALES b. 17 Febrero 1839