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Hi Reye,

My family is also partly from Moyahua. When you search, also look at Juchipila, Amoxochitl and Contitlan, Zac. I have a lot of Luna's in my tree from that entire area that are connected. The towns are very close to each other.

Also, a tip, anything can happen in a family tree... So don't walk away from the possibility of your other family also having a branch in Zac. My family went back and forth between Zac, Jal and Aguascalientes throughout the generations.

Suerte and welcome!

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-----Original Message-----
From: reye611

Date: Mon, 16 Jun 2008 14:05:41
To:research@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] Diaz Family - Tepatitlan De Morelos, Jalisco,
also Luna - Mayahua De Estrada, Zacatecas

Hello, I am new to the group and in the process of researching my father's family (Diaz) which is from Tepatitlan De Morelos, Jalisco. I have included what I know so far. I am still awaiting some records from the Family History

Hi Reye,

My family is also partly from Moyahua. When you search, also look at Juchipila, Amoxochitl and Contitlan, Zac. I have a lot of Luna's in my tree from that entire area that are connected. The towns are very close to each other.

Also, a tip, anything can happen in a family tree... So don't walk away from the possibility of your other family also having a branch in Zac. My family went back and forth between Zac, Jal and Aguascalientes throughout the generations.

Suerte and welcome!

Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T

-----Original Message-----
From: reye611

Date: Mon, 16 Jun 2008 14:05:41
To:research@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] Diaz Family - Tepatitlan De Morelos, Jalisco,
also Luna - Mayahua De Estrada, Zacatecas

Hello, I am new to the group and in the process of researching my father's family (Diaz) which is from Tepatitlan De Morelos, Jalisco. I have included what I know so far. I am still awaiting some records from the Family History

> Ive included abt a 5 min lookup for you what I found

DIAZ RAMIREZ GENERATION
1. LORENSO DIAS RAMIRES - International Genealogical Index Gender: Male Christening: 15 AUG 1852 Tepatitlan De Morelos, Jalisco, Mexico 2. JUAN DIAS RAMIRES - International Genealogical Index Gender: Male Christening: 02 JUL 1854 Tepatitlan De Morelos, Jalisco, Mexico
3. VICENTE DIAS RAMIRES - International Genealogical Index Gender: Male Christening: 24 JAN 1866 Tepatitlan De Morelos, Jalisco, Mexico
4. LADISLAO DIAS RAMIRES - International Genealogical Index Gender: Male Christening: 28 JUN 1856 Tepatitlan De Morelos, Jalisco, Mexico
4. LADISLAO DIAS RAMIRES - International Genealogical Index Gender: Male Christening: 28 JUN 1856 Tepatitlan De Morelos, Jalisco, Mexico
6. LUCIA DIAS RAMIREZ - International Genealogical Index Gender: Female Christening: 27 JUN 1858 Tepatitlan De Morelos, Jalisco, Mexico
7. JULIO DIAZ RAMIRES - International Genealogical Index Gender: Male Christening: 15 APR 1850

I am also related to the same Aceves in Tepa. Were double cousins! I made a mistake your Manuel Dias should be a grandchild of my gggggf Pedro Diaz Castellano he only had one son and the rest were daughters. His name was Joseph Diaz Castellano. I would definetly order the marriage for your manuel! Your manuel should have been born ca. 1725 or so and a great grandson; my mistake. Manuel should be a son of Joseph. I will look into this.
_________________________________________________________________
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Well this is very interesting I am descended from the same family Pedro Diaz~Castellano from from Spain who arrived in Mexico in the
ca. 1680? They made their way to Tepatitlan or firstly to Guadalajara as the story goes. Well, Reye your line isnt that far from the original trunk of the tree since you say your abt 1730 presently i would guess you Jose Nicolas is a grandson of our ancestor? I know im also confused as i type this. -Daniel del Camino
_________________________________________________________________
Enjoy 5 GB of free, password-protected online storage.
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you should also know that alejandro and teresa also have a son named celedonio. i found two other marriage dipensations related to the fernandez line.

Prima Linda,

Thanks for the link! Teresa Carlos de Godoy is my 6th GGM and that link provided me with several more generations of my direct ancestors. In addition, that link also help tie up other loose ends between my ancestors!

Jose Carlos de Leon

Qué tal compañeros,

Me gustaría hacer una aportación en este tema, que como bien dicen, es imporante y complejo.

Primeramente, recordemos que en México el Registro Civil inició en la década de 1850; anterior a la instauración de este organismo, no había regulación alguna en cuanto a "apellido paterno", "apellido materno", o el orden de usarlos. Por tradición, un recién nacido era conocido al nacer por el apellido del padre, pero ya pasados los años, una persona podía adoptar el apellido del padre, el de la madre, ambos, o una combinación de éstos con el de algún antepasado. Las razones? Diferenciación de familias con el mismo apellido, honrar a un antepasado o inclusive como requisito para reclamar herencias. Durante el siglo XVIII y anteriores, era muy frecuente que la hija que llevaba el nombre de la madre usara también el apellido de ésta.

Es correcto mencionar que la forma de estructurar dos apellidos toponímicos (con la partícula "De") es con la separación de la letra "y". Sin

Estimado Valente,

Tienes una pregunta sumamente importante. Mi abuelo siempre decía, el apellido del castellano es importante. Sea quien sea.

Efectivamente no era ponerle “de” o “y” en fin era su apellido. Como dices sería correcto José Doroteo de Castro y Solórzano, ya que Castro y Solórzano son toponímicos. No sería Doroteo de Castro y de Solórzano ya que sabemos que los dos son toponímicos. Para no repetir DE tantas veces se utiliza la preposición “y”. Ahora si el apellido era compuesto o sea el apellido entero era del linaje paterno (hijo, padre, abuelo) pudiera ser “de Castro y Solórzano” o “de Castro Solórzano” depende la genealogía.

El tema de apellidos de los siglos aun es muy interesante para cualquier estudioso. Sé que en España aun utilizan la preposición “y”, también he escuchado en el Distrito Federal de México.

De hecho mucha gente dice que los apellidos compuestos terminaron con la independencia, pero esto es falso. Algunos terminaron con ellos por sus razones

Buena pregunta!, en la actualidad oficialmente ya no se usan los "apellidos
de casada" o sea que ya no cambia el nombre de las mujeres al casarse, lo se
por experiencia, cuando quise sacar el pasaporte con mi nuevo nombre de
casada, me regañaron y me dijeron que eso ya no se usaba, que causaba muchos
problemas legales, asi que si las mujeres queremos usar el apellido de
nuestro esposo es puramente "estetico" para que reconozcan cual es la mamá
de fulanito en la escuela jajaja

2011/7/19

> Saludos a todos, les tengo una pregunta: en la epoca colonial era costumbre
> ponerle a los apellidos con "de", como mi ancestro José Doroteo de Castro,
> español de las Barrancas de Zacoalco de Torres. Su apellido materno de
> Doroteo era "Solórzano". Mi pregunta es si en esos tiempos se les pondría o
> se les consideraba como "José Doroteo de Castro y Solórzano"? Tambien como
> sería la forma correcta de escribir esos apellidos?
>
> Mi otra pregunta es de los apellidos matrimoniales que

Hello Daniel,

Katherine Brecht, who has indexed records from Sagrada Mitra, recently announced on the Nueva Galicia Genealogical Society's FB group page, that she will begin indexing the Morelia Informaciones matrimoniales y actas diversas. She might be looking for assistance. Look her up, I believe she's a member of this group.

Saludos!
Manny Diez Hermosillo

See map. There are two Coculiten, one in Zacatecas and one in Jalisco.

https://mapcarta.com/20289796

Thank you

You cannot simply look at the numerical result provided in the ancestry.com DNA report, you also have to look at the ranges, or uncertainties in those numbers.

Both my wife (who is of Mexican descent through all of her ancestors, with a typical mix of Spanish, Basque, Indian, and black ancestors) and I (with mainly British Isles and Central European ancestors, but no Mexican ancestry) did the ancestry.com test. My wife's Great Britain component is 3%, with a range of 0-13%. Based on our research a number closer to 0% makes more sense. My result is 18%, with a range of 0-44%. Based on our research, a number higher than 18% makes more sense.

The report is a specific number, with a range. Your "true" result could be anywhere in that range.

My point is that these numbers are only estimates, and some are subject to very substantial uncertainty.

George

That's a high percentage! My grandmother has a 10% for British Isles and 8% for Scandinavia. There is no paper trail that leads to either of those locations-- I guess those genes are persistent! My grandma's family is originally from the Jalisco, Zacatecas, and Guanajuato areas.

I descend from two "de la Puente" lines, I am not sure how they are related, but do believe they are close relatives as both are from the same general area.

The first line is as follows:
Diego de la Puente cc. Catalina López Rodríguez
Olaya de la Puente cc: Antonio de Medina, married on 20 Jun 1697 in Venado SLP
Luis de Medina cc. María Martínez de Sotomayor, dispensados 5 Apr 1733 Jalpa, Zacatecas.
Anastasia de Medina cc. Bernardo Ramírez de Oliva (I descend from two of their daughters)
a) María de Jesús Ramírez de Oliva cc. Rafael Ruiz de Salazar, b) Bárbara Ramírez de Oliva cc. Jesús González de Rubalcaba

The Ruiz de Salazar married into the Flores-Alatorre family who married into García de Rojas who married into Camino.
The González de Rubalcaba married into Velasco who married into García de Rojas and the López Portillo who married into Camino, my mother's lines.

The second lines is as follows:
Nicolás de la Puente cc. Tomasina Pérez de Contreras y Lomelín (originarios de

Es posible que se relacione DIEGO DE LA PUENTE? El caso con Catalina Rodriguez en Venado aprox. en 1770, no tengo mayores datos de ellos. Solo se que su familia vino de Burgos.

Simona,

I don't know if this Thomas de la Puente is related, but theres a Tomas de la Puente on the Wikitree, probably born around 1620

http://www.wikitree.com/wiki/De_la_Puente-3

Danny C. Alonso

Desafortunadamente los registros parroquiales de Jalpa efectivamente son perdidos o quemados. Pero las parroquias circunvecinas como las de Teocaltiche, Mezquitic, Aguascalientes, el Teúl, Moyahua, Momax, Tlatenango, Momax, etc. He estudiado esta región por más de 15 años y he notado que mucha de la población en esta area del Valle de Huejúcar, Huanusco y Tabasco llegaron de estas áreas. Tendrás que revisar muchísimos registros pero vale la pena. Mi vínculo a esta región es por mi mamá que nació en Aguascalientes pero fue criada en Calvillo.

Daniel Méndez de Torres y Camino

Arturo,

I'm so glad to see your notice about your book. You share many lines of ancestry with my children. They are descended from Jose Felix Serrano, son of Jose Francisco Serrano and Maria Agapita Cornejo. The family spans from Villa Guerrero and Totatiche back to Tlaltenango de Sanchez Roman.

I'd like to buy a copy of the book and since this notice is several years old I wondered if it was available now in an Ebook or Kindle version.

Best wishes,
Allison Peacock
Austin, TX

Arturo:

El libro lo vende en México o en EE UU? si es en EEUU, lo envían a México?

SALUDOS.

Chema

Is it possible to provide a table of contents for your book?
Sergio Gutierrez

Gracias por las noticias Arturo. Estoy muy ancioso de comprar su libro sobre las primeras
familias de Tlatenango. Realmente para un genealogista novohispano o neogallego es importante
estudiar todo que lo contiene. Al respeto de Tlatenango era un puesto importantisimo en Zacatecas
durante la colonia. Esa area entre Tabasco, Juchipila, Jalpa y Nochistlan, Tlatenango, etc ya que sabemos
que entre estos lugares habia mucha migracion entre ellos y de los Altos de Jalisco y Aguascalientes.

Al respeto de Tlatenango, mis lineas que llegan ahi son los Flores-Alatorre, Fernandez de Lamas,
Rojas-Barrera, Miramontes, los Haro como ya menciono, familias que llegaron tambien a Aguascalientes,
donde la mayoridad de mis estudio y enfoco es ya que es el lugar de mi familia materna.

Tambien mi libro ya viene que se publicara en algunos meses,
Extracciones de espan~oles en los archivos de Aguascalientes: Siglo XVII ,
No solo se enfocara en los libros parroquiales de dicho siglo (bautismos

Hola Danny:

Hay un artículo publicado como "Del Siglo VIII al XXI: Apuntes Genealógicos del marquesado de Villamayor de las Hibernias en el Blog Genealogía Novohispana:

genealogíanovohispana.blogspot.mx/2011_09_01archive.htlm

Ahí viene la genealogía paterna de Don Hernando, quien desciende de la casa de los Fernández de Córdoba del Señorío de Guadalcázar.

Por la parte materna desciende de Don Egidio Bocanegra almirante de Castilla, cuyos descendientes son del señorío de Palma del Río.

Alfaro

Puedes leer en la página genelógica Alfaro buscando como "Los caballeros Sevillanos Alfaro Bravo de Lagunas" esta familia trabajó en favor del Duque de Béjar tanto en España como en Nueva España y otros virreinatos.

Ponce de León

En el libro Sumaria Relación de las cosas de la Nueva España de Baltasar Dorantes de Carranza se mencionan varias mujeres de la familia Ponce De León casadas con las familias de los conquistadores Vázquez de Coronado, Pérez de Bocanegra.

Saludos

Marcelina

Peredo,
This is also an area of interest to me.
My 8th great grandmother was Maria de Sandobal, born about 1685 in Tlaltenango de Sanchez Roman, Zacatecas, Mexico.
She was the daughter of Francisco de Sandobal and Juana Ponce (Ponze, Ponse), born about 1660-65. My family tree has a well documented line back to Juana.
Having said that, there are numerous trees on Ancestry.com that have Juana as the daughter of Catalina Ponce de Leon and back to the famous explorer. I have never found a Baptism record for Juana and thus can't confirm that relationship. If someone can provide a document to prove the link, I would be the 15 great grandson of Juan Ponce de Leon

This link is an example of one of those posted family trees:

http://person.ancestry.com/tree/28477012/person/12491890250/facts

I own a copy of John J. Browne Ayes' book: Juan Ponce de Leon - His New and Revised Genealogy. I'll look to see if there is any mention of Hernan. Thanks for bringing this question to the forefront as

Peredo,
This is also an area of interest to me.
My 8th great grandmother was Maria de Sandobal, born about 1685 in Tlaltenango de Sanchez Roman, Zacatecas, Mexico.
She was the daughter of Francisco de Sandobal and Juana Ponce (Ponze, Ponse), born about 1660-65. My family tree has a well documented line back to Juana.
Having said that, there are numerous trees on Ancestry.com that have Juana as the daughter of Catalina Ponce de Leon and back to the famous explorer. I have never found a Baptism record for Juana and thus can't confirm that relationship. If someone can provide a document to prove the link, I would be the 15 great grandson of Juan Ponce de Leon

This link is an example of one of those posted family trees:

http://person.ancestry.com/tree/28477012/person/12491890250/facts

I own a copy of John J. Browne Ayes' book: Juan Ponce de Leon - His New and Revised Genealogy. I'll look to see if there is any mention of Hernan. Thanks for bringing this question to the forefront as

Muy interesante gracias, pero dígame como hago para búscalos? con gusto ayudare en lo que pueda .

Rick,

Two good news for you:

1) Date of marriage (Feb. 09/1762) is an indexing mistake. Correct date is Feb. 09/1763. You can find the record in image 330 of 495, Marriages 1736-1771 (Page 270; record 399).

2) It does include parents names.

Arturo,

I've never seen indigena blanca before on records but I have seen the term mulata blanca before and I guess that means that a child looks light but definitely has two mulato parents, so it probably means that by looking at the parents they'd be Indios but the daughter looks much less India than her parents.

Danny C. Alonso

The Catholic Church has had a very important role in recording data of individuals throughout Mexico's history after the arrival of Europeans. Most people, including natives, were recorded on parish records. Some older parish books tended to segregate people and sometimes there were "libros de indios" (for indigenous people) and "libros de castas" (for everyone else). You may need some luck to research your indigenous ancestors because often, the surnames of the children or parents were not listed, and that makes it even more difficult.

I encountered this issue when trying to find a marriage record for one of my ancestors. I kept searching for the groom's last name, and found nothing. Eventually, I decided to look for the bride and I was able to find the record. She was listed as "espanola" and it listed her last name as well as her parents. The groom, however, was listed as "indio" and there was no mention of his last name or the last name of his parents.

Steve in NC

I'm going to comment so I can keep up with this conversation. I'm looking for the same. I have only one line of the four grandparents I'm researching that is traceable beyond two generations. They are listed as "indigena" so I'm stumped, too!

Rafa,

This might help you.

I use Google to search Nuestros Ranchos for me.

In the Google search field I type in my keywords or questions and then I add the following so that Google only searches the Nuestros Ranchos website.

site:nuestrosranchos.org

Example: lomeli lines site:nuestrosranchos.org

The search results should all be from Nuestros Ranchos and they should all include lomeli and lines in them.

It's not a perfect system and it may take some practice, but it should save you time.

I hope this helps.

G Alvarez

My best guess Rafa:
... hl. de Jose Losano y Gumercinda Leon Abuelos paternos Jesus (Losano) y Lucia Torres maternos Santos (Leon) y Nepomucena Garcia ...

Hope it helps.

Hola Linda:

Hay varias posibilidades respecto del haplogrupo N en México:

1. Los vikingos invadieron cuatro veces la península ibérica. Puedes leer en la wikipedia un resumen llamado "Los vikingos en la península ibérica" pudieron dejar descendencia.

2. El Rey Carlos I de España y V de Alemania llevó alemanes a España como mineros y como maestros artilleros, pudieron pasar nórdicos con este grupo.

3. Esos mineros vinieron a Indias con "La Armada de los Alemanes" de la casa Fuquer, primero a Colombia y luego a Nueva España.

4. El apellido Gutierrez proviene del nombre Walter o Watari, godo, según la página celtiberia.net.

Me ha tocado investigar el apellido Ledesma, del que tengo la hipótesis proviene de una tribu eslava asentada en Cracovia.

Estos Ledesma en Querétaro se desprende de la rama de Zacatecas, Jalisco y Aguascalientes.

Saludos

Marcelina

Saludos

I just found another child born around 1765 (marriage records states he is 28 yo)

Claudio
Since the children were it seems all born in Encarnacion de Diaz, Jalisco, his parents were probably married in the same location abt 1763-65 (last child might be 1785)only Encarnacion's records dont start until 1789 for IM and marriages 1778.

I found that all of the following have a San Antonio where Claudio was born
Bolanos, San Juan de los Lagos, Teocaltiche, La Barca, Atotonilco el Alto and Zapotlan. perhaps one of the membership familiar with this may provide further insight of where the records of Encarnacion were before this time.

Juan Martin De Torres
1750–Deceased • 9ZQ5-NFB​
Ana Jacinta De Los Santos
1753–Deceased • 9ZQ5-NYN

Emilie could it have been tifo?

that's typhus
Linda

Do you have the link?

Danny C. Alonso

Rafa,

¿ya consultaste en el Registro Civil?, En Sayula no hay para el nacimiento de Inocencio ~ 1862 pero sí hay para el año de 1885 libro de matrimonios civiles. A lo mejor ahí aparece más información.

Saludos,

BMF