TEST SITE - DO NOT USE - Development only

Emily..sorry..i think I got the wrong info..raul

On Friday, September 12, 2014 2:05 AM, Emilie Garcia wrote:

Can someone tell me who the paternal and maternal grandparents are and the padrinos for Macaria Haro Serrano is?

https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-1-15245-16155-78?cc=1804458&wc… (Image 287)

Thank you,

Emilie
Port Orchard,, WA

Emily..the Paternals are: Bautista De Haro and Maria Carlos Serrano; maternals are: Yrineo de Haro and Maria de Jesus Valenzuela; Padrinos are: Miguel......? and Maria de Refugio Avila. Could not quite make out Miguel's last name. Raul

On Friday, September 12, 2014 2:05 AM, Emilie Garcia wrote:

Can someone tell me who the paternal and maternal grandparents are and the padrinos for Macaria Haro Serrano is?

https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-1-15245-16155-78?cc=1804458&wc… (Image 287)

Thank you,

Emilie
Port Orchard,, WA

Hi Emile,

Here is what I read:

paternal grandparents: Irineo de Haro and María de Jesús Valenzuela
maternal grandparents: Antonio Serrano and Hermenegilda Miramontes
godparents: Miguel Corrales? and María del Refugio Ávila

Best regards.
Austin Perez

We've stayed there and it's absolutely beautiful. In colonial times it was
a hotel for people and their horses, you could stable your horse and stay
in the upper room.

Alicia,
San Jose, Ca

On Thu, Sep 11, 2014 at 8:54 PM, wrote:

> If any of you ever go to downtown Ciudad of Zacatecas? And you pass
> through the hotel, "Meson Del Jobito?" There are two large paintings of
> the Second Conde and his wife of the Hacienda of San Mateo on the wall near
> the receiptionist. We have seen it when my woman and me took a short cut
> through the block by passing through the hotel. When I saw those
> paintings, I told my woman who they are.
> http://oi59.tinypic.com/2niz90p.jpg
>
> Here is the website of Meson Del Jobito Hotel:
>
> http://www.mesondejobito.com.mx/index.php/tour-virtual

Tambien tengo de Garibaldo en el arbol, pero no puedo ayar antes de 1800. El ultimo es Calletano de Garibaldo casado con Guadalupe Rodriguez en Sahauyo Michoacan. Sahuayo esta al otro Aldo del lago Chapala. Todos los Garibaldos Tienen que ser familia por que no ay muchos. Gracias por la informacion.

>
> garibaldiimss,

Dispensa, pero no se tu nombre. Quisiera poder ayudarte, pero apenas
encontré este apellido en mi familia. Llegando yo a la octava generación
cuando aparece este apellido en mi árbol. Tal vez tu me puedas ayudar. En
mi caso se trata de mi ancestra Laureana Garcia quien se casó con Francisco
Vidaurre an Tlajomulco de Zuñiga, Jalisco, el 26 de Abril 1802. Los padres
de Laureana eran Toribio Garcia y María Antonia Garibaldo.

¿No sabes si María Antonia Garibaldo proviene de la misma linea que tus
ancestros?

Gracias, y ojalá que pudieramos ayudarnos el uno al otro.

Maria Cortez
Sacramento, CA

He estado investigando, desde hace 7 a?os el ?rbol genealogico de el
apellido De Garibaldo. He llegado hasta diez generaciones atraz y estoy
detenido a causa de que ya no encuentro registros. El ?ltimo que tengo es
del Matrimonio de Lorenzo De Garibaldo con Catalina Sorita, efectuado en
enero de 1660 en el Sagrario Metropolitano de Guadalajara. Hay alguien que
me pudiese

Edgar Olguin Diaz

buen dia amigo

me tome la tarea de investigar esta familia suena muy interesante me profundare mas en ella aver si puedo encontrar mas informacion que te pueda ayudar lo unico que encontrer asi rapido fue esto:

lorenso garibaldo y catalina surita matrimonio el 8 nero 1660 sagrario metropolitano guadaljara jalisco .

nicolas garibaldo surita nacido en 1664 guadalajara jalisco padres lorenso de garibaldo y catalina surita

chrisptobal garibaldo sorita nacido en 1667 guadalajara jalisco padres lorenso de garibaldo y catalina sorita

este ultimo puede ser de la misma familia :
ramon garibaldo vesa nacio en 1673 en guadalajara jalisco padres lorenso de garibaldo y catalina de la vesa

aqui cambia el apellido de catalina de surita al de la vesa.

una pregunta en el registro matrimonial en 1660 vienen los padres de ambos?

teniendo noticias te las hare saber amigo (a)
que tengas un excelenete dia
saludos
estamos en contacto

Hello Roberto,

I have the following information for Sebastian Merino son of Bernabe Merino and Maria Gutierrez:

Sebastián Merino (February 1636 - ? ) m. Juana del Castillo m. María de Jaén m. Nicolasa Ruiz de Esparza

1. María Merino, daughter of Juana del Castillo ( ? - September 21, 1694) m. January 28, 1691 in Aguascalientes to Antonio Núñez
a. María Antonia Núñez (December 1692 - May 1, 1742) m. May 8, 1709 in Aguascalientes to Domingo de Medina

2. Nicolás Merino, hijo natural, m. March 20, 1695 in Aguascalientes to Antonia Montaño (aka Burgos)
a. María Merino ( ? - November 7, 1738) m. Cayetano Arias
b. Juana Merino de Burgos ( ? - July 16, 1710) m. Martín Monreal
c. Antonia de Burgos m. Lorenzo Calvillo
d. José Manuel Merino (March 27, 1695 - ? )
e. Nicolás Merino, hijo natural, (July 1698 - ? )

3. Sebastin de Arenas, hijo natural. This Sebastian maybe the one who was married to Tomasa Rodriguez?

My Merino/Arenas ancestry is from Bartolome

That's what I thought it was, but someone found another entry in the same batch where it was clearly written as Aposolco. We were close.

Emilie

> Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2014 06:43:04 +0000
> From: rayjaur@comcast.net
> To: research@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
> Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Research Digest, Vol 104, Issue 7
>
> Emilie, looks like, APOSILCO.

Andelmo Perez

That would be Apozolco. It is part of el municipal de La Yesca.

Ivan

WorldCat at http://www.worldcat.org is a good way to find libraries that have certain books, at least in those libraries that are part of the system.

WorldCat only gives one library in California that has Los Protocolos de Rodrigo Hernandez Cordero. This is UC Berkeley/Bancroft Library.

Retoños de España is much easier to find: a number of libraries in the San Francisco/Northern California area have it. The Sutro branch of the California State Library (located on the San Francisco State Campus) has a circulating copy.

The university libraries may have restrictions to students, faculty, and alumni, although in some cases you may be able to purchase a library card. The UC Berkeley Bancroft Library has public access, but their materials do not circulate, they also have restrictions on what and how much of a book may be photocopied. They may allow you to photograph materials, but there is a fee to do so.

With WorldCat when you enter your zip code it identifies libraries that are

Buenos dias Joseph... me gustaria saber como lehagopara localizar a una
persona nacida por los años 1885 -1890 En zacatecas de nombre Juan Torres
Rosales..

Me podras indicar como le ago para obteber sus datos..

mIL gracias

I agree with this.

Emilie
Port Orchard, WA

> Date: Thu, 4 Sep 2014 22:27:19 -0700
> From: rcafartista@gmail.com
> To: general@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
> Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] Opening up the group to Colima and Nayarit descendants
>
> I have been a group member for a couple of years and have enjoyed the
> discussion on a number of topics. While I consider myself to be an active
> genealogist, I have been limited (with some exceptions) to exploring the
> areas of Tamazula de Gordiano and Ciudad Guzman, Jalisco. These Jalisco
> connections are my father's side. The other long strand of family comes
> from Sinaloa. That work is much like the work of Jalisco--mostly church
> records of baptisms and marriages.
>
> My sense is that opening up to the other two states, Colima and Nayarit,
> will not produce great numbers of people because most 20th century
> immigration to the U.S. has come from the areas of Jalisco, Zacatecas,
> Michoacan, Guanajuato, Sonora and other northern

Andelmo Perez

First of all thanks for adding Nayarit. I didn't realize until I started my research that Nayarit was part of Jalisco.
I'm interested in the families of Perez, Manjarrez, Zambrano, Macias, Medina, Salazar & Gutierrez all from Nayarit & parts of Zacatecas. Can go back to early 1800s. Been having the best of luck with Zambrano. Can go back to mid 1700s to Pasqual Zambrano of Amatlan de Jora. Looking forward to helping people out & getting feedback.

I do support the idea of simply adding to the forums a space for those states that a some point in time where under Nueva Galicia territories with out changing the whole structure of the site. Areas change with time frames and in some places is just a few towns that really matter. In my opinion this group can always allow towns (not necessarily the whole state, been Nayarit probably the exception) to be studied within the focused states specially when there was a political relation, not just a family connection, this in my opinion can prevent loosing the Area we are interested the most, but keeping at hand those places that may be essential to our studies, as an example from my own, I have interest in Nombre de Dios, Durango, which is at the border with Zacatecas and after a few year trying to figure it out why one of my ancestor moved from there to Nochistlán I realized that Nombre de Dios was part of Nueva Galicia and was used as a "frontier", a "land of captains" I called myself

Having not read all the messages sent in reply to this thread, I am still going to share my opinion.

Nuestros Ranchos as is one of the best Mexican Genealogy sites, that I have seen. Some of the reasons for that is quality of the ownership of the site (Joseph) and maintainace done by Arturo. Joseph has been really good at trying to keep the group on track with the stated purpose of the group.

Another reason, is the quality of the members in the group. We have a blend of new researchers, seasoned researchers, and some professional researchers. This pool of experience allows us to make progress in our research efforts.

By expanding the groups focus into other states, it will allow other researchers to enter and share their experience with the group, also it will allow those us already in the group to share our knowledge of researching in other areas of Mexico.

Once, allowing one, two, three or more states into the group where do we draw the line.

As I stated in the beginning

When this discussion began I was of the opinion that we should expand to include other states. However, after reading others' opinions I opine that we should maintain the Nuestros Ranchos Group as it was set up and limit it to Jalisco, Aguascaliente, and Zacatecas. Occasionally we have had posts and "findings" which have taken us to other states, but this has not been the norm.

There are groups that include "Nueva Galicia" and people can join those groups if they choose to include a wider range of territory in their research.

Deedra Corona

I posted before that I would not mind adding states to the focus area of Nuestros Ranchos, but after reading several comments by other members, I have to agree that adding new areas will alienate the majority of members, and many posts will remain unanswered. We can argue that we should add this state for this reason and that state for another reason, but at what point should we stop? The success of this group, now I see it, is due in part to the fact that it focuses in only three neighboring states. If there is a strong interest to add a specific state, it might be a better idea to create a new forum for that state, and that will benefit all. That's my opinion. My vote was for a yes, now I'm inclined to say no.

Hola Joseph , hola primos!!!

Les saludo con gusto y les dseo un gran día.

Les comento que soy de los miembros del grupo a que hace referencia Joseph y que atinada mente señala como los miembros callados, los quie participan poco de las discuciones y la razón de esto, es justa mente que en mi búsqueda particular he encontrado poco que decir en referencia a los temas tratados, pues el universo de discución es muy grande y pocas ocasiones coincide con mis investigaciones y con mis ancestros, que aunque son por mi rama paterna oriundos de los estados de Jalisco, Zacatecas y de Aguascalientes, que antes fuera parte del primer estado. Aún así, me he sentido extraño al leer la mayoría de los temas tratados, porque no he encontrado una conexión con mi búsqueda. así que abriendo más todavía el universo de investigación, la inmensa mayoría quedaremos desconectados de los temas tratados. también hago investigación de mi línea materna en los estados de Puebla, Veracruz y la Ciudad de México

I am for expanding it to only to Colima and Nayarit. Many of the Nueva Galicia settlers of the XVI century traveled and often and even established themselves in these states. Someone mentioned changing the name of the forum to "Descendants of Nueva Galicia." This may be a good suggestion, not the name, but a more specific to our area of research.

Estoy de acuerdo con la opción en que abramos el foro a los estados de Nayarit y Colima. Muchísimos de los colonizadores de la Nueva Galicia durante el siglo XVI viajaban entre estos límites. Efectivamente, el estudioso sabrá que familias numerosas de la Nueva Galicia se establecieron en esas tierras. Otro mencionó cambiar el nombre del grupo a "Descendientes de la Nueva Galicia." Creo que es un gran idea, no el nombre, más ser aun específico a nuestra área de estudio.
Daniel Méndez de Torres Camino

There are good reasons to expand the focus of the group, for example due to movement of people between the various towns in this part of Mexico. Perhaps Guanajuato would be a possibility: Capn. Tomas de Villalpando, an early settler in the Aguascalientes area came from Leon, Guanajuato. My wife's paternal family is from Guanajuato. Her maternal ancestors include many of the prominent families of the early 1600s in Aguascalientes; but the only connection on her maternal side to Guanajuato is Tomas de Villalpando.

That said, making the focus too broad means a lot of what we see may not be of interest. For example, I belong to an Austrian genealogy group with a mailing list like NR. This group covers all of the former Austro-Hungarian empire: I seldom see much of interest, and when I post something for my areas of interest, there is often no response from the group.

With the current NR focus much of what I see is of interest.

Perhaps if there were "special interest" groups within NR

I posted about the fact that Nayarit part of Jalisco until relatively recently (1917). However, I really do think we need to be careful in NOT opening the group up to all kinds of states.

I agree with those who have said that the group's success has been due to its narrow focus. If we open it up to historically important, but also distinct regions such as Chihuahua or Guanajuato, we will lose the focus. Yes, there are families that went to or came from those states, but they were distinct from the time of Mexican Independence. Without the focus, our topics will become too broad, or there will be too many families to keep track of.

And if we really consider opening up to more states we should probably have a formal vote/survey.

Let's keep helping one another, but without becoming just another broad geneaology forum...

Sergio Salés

Simple and easy, researchers with concentration in Nayarit
and Colima can create their own forum.

The success of this forum has been due to the concentration of
research on the three states.By opening the group
to other states, we would lose the focus.

Above all, we do not need to alienate the current membership,
who have contributed vast amounts of information, and time behind the scene to helped
make Nuestros Ranchos’ such a success.

Yes, all of the states have tight historical links however, If
we begin to include a few states, then we might as well include the entire
country.

A definite NO vote…with encouragement to start a new forum
for those who research states outside the current Nuestros Ranchos realm.

On Saturday, August 30, 2014 5:36 AM, Joseph Puentes wrote:

What are the good reasons and bad reasons to open up the group to the states
of Nayarit and Colima? Can y’all generate some discussion on that topic?
Let’s hear the pros and cons.

Do you think that

How about opening it up to Chihuahua or maybe states now that used to be part of Nuevo Galicia? Could you poll the members to see which states they would like to open up, and open those?

Emilie
Port Orchard, WA

> From: makas@nc.rr.com
> To: general@nuestrosranchos.org
> Date: Fri, 29 Aug 2014 21:59:49 -0400
> Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] Nayarit and/y Colima
>
>
>
> What are the good reasons and bad reasons to open up the group to the states
> of Nayarit and Colima? Can y’all generate some discussion on that topic?
> Let’s hear the pros and cons.
>
>
>
> Do you think that opening the group to those doing research in Nayarit and
> Colima would suddenly open the group to vast numbers of new members? Would
> the discussions wildly go into topics that would alienate the current
> membership? There are many members of the group that rarely speak out.
> Please consider stepping into this discussion. I’d like feel the groups
> pulse on this thought.
>
>
>
> ¿Cuáles son las

My maternal Delgado line left Tlaltenango and Atolinga,Zacatecas after 300+ years and settled in La Yesca and Ixtlan del Rio, Nayarit in the late 1800's. My mother was born in Ixtlan del Rio, Nayarit.

On my paternal Rojas side, my last name started out as Roxas in Amatlan de Jora, Nayarit in the early 1700's. They then settled in Hostotipaquillo, Jalisco in 1840's.

You could say that my roots started and ended in Nayarit.

PROS
It would help to share information with other members from Nayarit. Currently, all the information I have on Nayarit is my own 3 year research with no help.

CONS
Current members with no ties to Nayarit or Colima may not be able to help new members with research or information.Website would have a lot of postings with no replies.

I would still vote yes for Nayarit because of my ties.

Ruben Rojas Delgado

I agree with the other posts. There is a strong historical connection between Jalisco and Nayarit, as well as Colima if you have ancestors in what was then the provincia de Avalos. I am tempted to say yes, however, this would broaden the area in this group, and you would have to think about other areas in Michoacan, Guanajuato, Durango and other states closely related to our focus states. It's a tough question, but I would vote yes on Nayarit and Colima, even though I don't have ancestors on this states.

I'm sure in the long run the addition of new members from these states will benefit the group.

Steve

Considering Nayarit was carved out of Jalisco, I'd say it's a good idea. In a recent article, I wrote:

At the time of Mexican independence, Nayarit was part of Jalisco. In November 1824, the political constitution of the State of Jalisco was established, dividing the territory into eight districts. Nayarit was called the Seventh District of Jalisco. On August 7, 1867, after the defeat of the French invasion, President Benito Juárez separated Nayarit from Jalisco, declaring it to be the "Military District of Tepic," under the jurisdiction of the government.On December 12, 1884, by order of Article 43 of the Federal Constitution, Nayarit was elevated to the status of a territory separate from Jalisco. This federal territory was divided into twenty municipios. In February 1917 the Territory of Nayarit was elevated to the status of a free and sovereign state under the provisions of the Constitution of 1917. The state was called Nayarit in honor of Nayar or Nayarit, the 16th century

Nayarit. I'm biased. My father was born in Nayarit, eventually crossing border. Serving in the military in WWII , he became a US citizen. As well, my maternal Abuelita Clemencia Lizarraga was born in Nayarit. At present my paternal ancestors date back to 1797, and my maternal line to 1684.

As a kid I had the good fortune to visit with my father the ranchito where he and several of his siblings were born.

I hope that Nuestros Ranchos will seriously consider including Nayarit. I made this request several years ago, since I believe that historically speaking this area was part of the geographical /political art of Colonial Mexico.

Paul

Paul J Gomez
Sent from my iPhone

> On Aug 29, 2014, at 6:59 PM, "Joseph Puentes" wrote:
>
>
>
> What are the good reasons and bad reasons to open up the group to the states
> of Nayarit and Colima? Can y’all generate some discussion on that topic?
> Let’s hear the pros and cons.
>
>
>
> Do you think that opening the group to those doing

There is book entitled "Haciendas of Mexico," published in 1886 that names the principal haciendas by state, along with the owner/proprietor, and the town where it is located.

The introduction is in English, and the rest of the book is just tables.

The book can be downloaded as a pdf from www.archive.org.

George Fulton
Pleasanton, CA

There's a Jabonera in the municipio of San Juan de Los Lagos, population: 9

It's mapped here: http://www.microrregiones.gob.mx/catloc/contenido.aspx?refnac=140730282

This is a very handy website: http://www.microrregiones.gob.mx/catloc/Default.aspx

I posted this website earlier this year, which I prefer above all the other map search engines because this lists any and all populated areas in Mexico whether they are still populated or no longer active. I also like it because you search by name, rather than hunt around on a map. Maybe I'll make a separate post for it because it really is helpful.

This government site is excellent for looking up the locations of towns & ranchos including those *that may no longer exist*. You can find non-existent or very small, unmapped towns/ranchos by clicking first on the name of the state, then municipality, then on the name of the town/rancho you're looking for, and whether it's currently active or no longer inhabited, it will be listed

Luis Arturo Huerta Rodrìguez

Hi Alice!

There is another ranch named "La Jabonera" in Nochistlán, Zac. About 80km from San Juan. My mother was born there.

Now you say it, I realize I hadn't investigate what signifies the name, I live in México and for me it may signify soap store or soap factory more than soapdish.

Greetings!!

Hello Alice,

I do a lot of research for Lagos de Moreno which is where my family is
from. I don't remember ever seeing the hacienda La Jabonera mentioned in
records from Lagos de Moreno and it isn't in the books I have or PDF
documents I have. I don't see it as being in Lagos de Moreno on Google Maps
or PueblosAmerica http://mexico.pueblosamerica.com/jalisco/lagos-de-moreno/
What did you use for the search in Google Maps? I have only seen La
Jabonera mentioned in the records for San Juan de Los Lagos and
PueblosAmerica
http://mexico.pueblosamerica.com/jalisco/san-juan-de-los-lagos/

I have asked cousins and uncles that still live in Lagos where certain
ranches are but they aren't familiar with all of them, even though they
live there, which is why I had to use the books, PDFs, and PueblosAmerica
site.

Lagos de Moreno and San Juan de Los Lagos share a border and sometimes
people that lived in one city had land in the adjacent city. I do know that
my father, aunts, and uncles from

There is another Jabonera near my parents hometown of El Bajio de San Jose, Jalisco which is in the municipio de Encarnacion de Diaz. My Dad told me that they used to make soap there and that is why it was named Jabonera.

Austin Perez

I have MA Delores Franco Campos who was baptized (1880) and married (1898) at San Juan Batista in San Juan de Los Lagos. I don't know if this is the same Campos family, or if it's of any help to you, but I do have siblings, parents, etc. all in San Juan de Los Lagos with some documents from the church records archived by Family Search.

You can contact me directly if you wish. Alejandro
AJB

I have relatives from Nayarit too. I would be in favor of including them.
If we're consider expanding could we consider other regions too?

Paige

Joseph,

Originally, in the early colonial days of Nueva España, the Nueva Galicia
region, encompassed the current day states of Nayarit, Colima,, Jalisco,
Zacatecas and Aguascalientes.

Alicia

On Thu, Aug 28, 2014 at 6:00 PM, Joseph Puentes wrote:

>
>
> An applicant to the group says this:
>
>
>
> "La Yesca municipality in Nayarit which was a part of Jalisco in the 19th
> century"
>
>
>
> Can someone please send me a list of places that historically were part of
> Jalisco, Zacatecas, and/or Aguascalientes but are in other states now?
>
>
>
> Thanks for your help
>
>
>
> Joseph
>
>
>
>
>
> Joseph Puentes
>
> Clean@h2opodcast.com
>
> http://h2opodcast.com/vsse.html
>
>
>
>
>

Joseph,
What we know today as Jalisco, Zacatecas and Aguascalientes did not exist during colonial times. The ideology of political divisions known as states was introduced well after the Mexican independence. For example, the state of Aguascalientes was incorporated into the "Intendencia de Zacatecas," Jalisco was known as "Intendencia de Guadalajara," etc. These new political divisions were a result of the many "Reformas Borbónicas" of the late XVIII century.
The "Reinos" under the Habsburg (Reino de Nueva Galicia, Nuevo León, Méjico, etc.) consisted of Alcaldía Mayores which were replaced with the Borbón Intendencias, later replaced with "Departamentos" under Agustín I up to Maximilian I. Mexico eventually adopted modernizing into the United States of Mexico. Something that many people are not aware is that the Alcaldía Mayores and Intendencias had provinces within them, political sub-divisions if you will. Some of the ones that pertain to our area were the Alcaldía Mayor de

I don't know about other states, but regarding Nayarit, it was part of the state of Jalisco and before that Nueva Galicia for centuries. It became a separate state less than 100 years ago, on January 26, 1917. Colima was also part of Jalisco, but became a state back in the 19th century.

I vote YES to Colima. Southern Jalisco belonged to the XVI century Province
of Colima. Both regions have tight historical links, still strong today.
Lots of families were moving around these territories. It is the case of
mine.