TEST SITE - DO NOT USE - Development only

I cut the 1650 Tlaltenango Padron into 5 chunks so it would be easier to
download. It is in the links area now:

go to:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ranchos/

then go to:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ranchos/links

then go to:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ranchos/links/1650_Tlaltenango_Cen_001131149315/

joseph

ps: thanks Arturo!

Emilie,

Don't despair.  Do what Angie suggests and check the Civil Registry
records.  What I find strange is that the dates don't quite check
because the Mexican Revolution started in 1910 not 1903.  Maybe it was
some other disaster or maybe they made a typo when they captured that
record.  I've seen microfilms whose contents don't exactly agree with
the index at the Library Catalog.  So maybe you can take a look at
those microfilms anyway just to be sure.  After all that, if you still
haven't found anything, then you can cry, but just a little!

Victor

--- In ranchos@yahoogroups.com, "Emilie Garcia" <auntyemfaustus@h...>
wrote:
>
> Oh, Angie, Victor,
> 
> I guess the priest my father talked to was correct.  The records for
1903 when my father was born were burned during the Revolucion.  The
films skip from 1902 to 1906.  I want to cry. 
> 
> Emilie
>   ----- Original Message ----- 
>   From: Emilie Garcia<mailto:auntyemfaustus@h...> 
>   To: ranchos@yahoogroups.com<mailto:ranchos@yahoogroups.com> 
>   Sent: Friday, November 04, 2005 2:07 PM
>   Subject: Re: [ranchos] Re: Bautismos de Hijos Legitimos
> 
> 
>   Thaks, Angie ---- I guess I never looked at the whole list for
Jerez and only saw the Bautismos on the top.
> 
>   Emilie Garcia 
>   Port Orchard, WA --
>     ----- Original Message ----- 
>     From: aajay1073<mailto:aajay1073@y...> 
>     To: ranchos@yahoogroups.com<mailto:ranchos@yahoogroups.com> 
>     Sent: Friday, November 04, 2005 1:36 PM
>     Subject: [ranchos] Re: Bautismos de Hijos Legitimos
> 
> 
>     Emilie,
> 
>     Here is this list:
>     Bautismos de hijos naturales 1867-1891 -  FHL INTL Film [ 439889 ]
>     Bautismos de hijos naturales 1891-1902 -  FHL INTL Film [ 439890 ]
>     Bautismos de hijos naturales 1906-1919 -  FHL INTL Film [ 439891 ]
>     Bautismos de hijos naturales 1953-1961 -  VAULT INTL Film [
439892 ] 
> 
>     Taken from this page:
>    

Okay I've created a special Yahoo ID and Password and created a
YahooGroup for Nueva Galicia.

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NuevaGalicia/

My purpose is to try to encourage people to join the group and start
formulating a plan for the future. A plan that would include a research
area that encompasses all of what Nueva Galicia was Historically. After
you all join and come to some kind of agreement as to who will run this
group and who will be moderators to help run it, I will turn over the
Yahoo ID/Password for ownership. Tied to this ID/Password is the email
address: NuevaGalicia2@...

So please I would encourage you to join this group and let the planning
start. Later if you want you can completely change anything and
everything. Since its just a planning committee group I made it unlisted
and private to group members only (no open archives).

I'll be part of the committee but only in a supportive role. I like the
idea of opening up the research area. I just don't have the stamina and
ability to do it myself. Later all the information files that are in
Ranchos and Juarez groups will be available to the group, but the
members individual genealogies will not. . .that would be up to the
discretion of the individual joining members.

joseph

Emilie,

Have you tried Civil Registration?  I don't know if I have the right 
city, but here is this list:

Nacimientos 1902 -  FHL INTL Film [ 1081920 ]
Nacimientos 1903-1904 -  FHL INTL Film [ 1081921 ]
Nacimientos 1905-1906 -  FHL INTL Film [ 1089629 ]

This was taken from:
http://www.familysearch.com/Eng/Library/fhlcatalog/printing/titledetai
lsprint.asp?titleno=310581

Good Luck on your search,
Angie Godina

--- In ranchos@yahoogroups.com, "Emilie Garcia" <auntyemfaustus@h...> 
wrote:
>
> Oh, Angie, Victor,
> 
> I guess the priest my father talked to was correct.  The records 
for 1903 when my father was born were burned during the Revolucion.  
The films skip from 1902 to 1906.  I want to cry. 
> 
> Emilie

Emilie,

Here is this list:
Bautismos de hijos naturales 1867-1891 -  FHL INTL Film [ 439889 ]
Bautismos de hijos naturales 1891-1902 -  FHL INTL Film [ 439890 ]
Bautismos de hijos naturales 1906-1919 -  FHL INTL Film [ 439891 ]
Bautismos de hijos naturales 1953-1961 -  VAULT INTL Film [ 439892 ] 

Taken from this page:
http://www.familysearch.com/Eng/Library/fhlcatalog/printing/titledetai
lsprint.asp?titleno=354158

Good luck on your search,
Angie Godina


--- In ranchos@yahoogroups.com, "Emilie Garcia" <auntyemfaustus@h...> 
wrote:
>
> Yesterday I was at the local FHC again poring over the microfilm 
for baptisms from Jerez around the time my father Guadalupe Olague 
was born (January 28, 1903).  I have never been able to locate my 
father's birth record in it, even though I have found his father in 
Tepetongo (Rancho Salitrillo) and others there back to the early 
1700's. While I was loading the film yesterday, I noticed that the 
title of the book filmed was "Bautismos de Hijos Legitimos", and sure 
enough, I did not find one "hijo natural" or "hijo de padre no 
conocido" in it.  It seems all other films I have searched included 
all baptisms, hijos naturales, adoptivos, etc. even if they made 
reference to other books where the actual names of the parents were 
written.  So, hmmm, was Daddy illegitimate?  If so, is there a book 
for "hijos naturales" that was not microfilmed?  What would such a 
book be called?  Where would one obtain info from such a book, and 
would it take an act of congress to get it?
> 
> My father at one time (in the early 1960's) needed a birth record 
for work and for Social Security and we went from California to Jerez 
to the church there only to have the priest tell him that all records 
for that time period had been burned during the Revolucion.  Sometime 
later, my father must have contacted a lawyer there because after my 
mother died and I was going through all their records, I found an 
affadavit to prove his previously unrecorded birth.  As testigos and 
witnesses that my father was born in Jerez were listed some men 
(maybe they are deceased by now) that bore the surnames of his 
parent's and grandparent's lines (Munos, Soriano. Escobedo, Garcia).  
His mother was Gorgonia Garcia.  Where and how did this lawyer find 
them?  One place name mentioned was "La Gavia", but it is not one of 

Linda,

Here's some additional information with what Arturo and Emile wrote.

Here is Marriage extract:
MANUEL ROMERO
  Male
Marriages:
  Spouse:  MARCELINA DE LA TORRE
  Marriage:  19 OCT 1870   Tepatitlan De Morelos, Jalisco, Mexico
Messages:
 Extracted marriage record for locality listed in the record. The 
source records are usually arranged chronologically by the marriage 
date.
Source Information:
 Batch No.:  Dates:  Source Call No.:
 M603739  1869 - 1876  0218529

The couple had at least two children:
+ JOSE MARCOS ROMERO TORRE
Gender: Male Christening: 07 OCT 1871 Tepatitlan De Morelos, Jalisco, 
Mexico
+ JOSE SERAPIO ROMERO TORRE
Gender: Male Christening: 14 NOV 1872 Tepatitlan De Morelos, Jalisco, 
Mexico

Here is Marriage extract:
JOSE DE LA TORRE
  Male
Marriages:
  Spouse:  ELENA ROMERO
  Marriage:  04 FEB 1880   Tepatitlan De Morelos, Jalisco, Mexico
Messages:
 Extracted marriage record for locality listed in the record. The 
source records are usually arranged chronologically by the marriage 
date.
 Batch No.:  Dates:  Source Call No.:
 M603741  1876 - 1881  0218530

I too am researching Romero and De La Torre but in a different area.  
My Romero's arrived in Colotlan, Jalisco in 1730's, before that they 
were in Victoria de Durango, Durango.  My De La Torre's are in 
Colotlan, Jalisco during 1740's.

When searching for De La Torre surname, be sure to keep a look out 
for these spelling variations, Torre(s), De La Thorre, Thorre(s).

Good luck on your search,
Angie Godina


--- In ranchos@yahoogroups.com, "Arturo Ramos" <arturo.ramos2@v...> 
wrote:
>
> Emilie:
> 
> That is a very good write up to get somebody started on this 
> research.  Be careful Linda, because once you start, it becomes a 
> sort of addiction.  The more you find, the more questions pop up 
and 
> the more you go looking.
> 
> Here is the IGI entry for your great-granparents' marriage in 
> Tepetitlan.  The next step would be to go to your family history 
> center and order this film.  It should list both the bride and the 
> groom's parents and then you should be able to find their baptism 
> records in IGI or VRI as well, and those often list grandparents in 
> addition to parents so you get two generations in one swoop.
> 
> MANUEL ROMERO  
>   Male   Family 
> Event(s): 
> Marriages: 
>   Spouse:  MARCELINA DE LA TORRE  Family 

Emilie:

That is a very good write up to get somebody started on this 
research.  Be careful Linda, because once you start, it becomes a 
sort of addiction.  The more you find, the more questions pop up and 
the more you go looking.

Here is the IGI entry for your great-granparents' marriage in 
Tepetitlan.  The next step would be to go to your family history 
center and order this film.  It should list both the bride and the 
groom's parents and then you should be able to find their baptism 
records in IGI or VRI as well, and those often list grandparents in 
addition to parents so you get two generations in one swoop.

MANUEL ROMERO  
  Male   Family 
Event(s): 
Marriages: 
  Spouse:  MARCELINA DE LA TORRE  Family 
  Marriage:  19 OCT 1870   Tepatitlan De Morelos, Jalisco, Mexico 

Batch No.: M603739
Source Call No.: 0218529 Film



--- In ranchos@yahoogroups.com, "Emilie Garcia" <auntyemfaustus@h...> 
wrote:
>
> Linda,
> 
> We mostly start by looking in the IGI in the FamilySearch.org 
website and then spending hours at our local Family History Center 
poring over microfilms.  Luck in finding information is mostly a 
matter of hard work.  There is no easy way.  You didn't give any 
dates in the  sketchy information you gave on your ancestry, or which 
resources you used.  It helps to know a little Spanish, but as 
limited as my Spanish is, I have learned a lot just by poring over 
the microfilms.  The priests wrote everything in a certain format, 
and the Family History Center in your area (please note your location 
from now on so we know where you are) can get you a copy of 
their "Mexico Parish Record Extraction Training Guide" and 
their "Spanish Indexing Reference".  It is instructions for their 
extractors, but you can tell them you need it for your extractions 
since they can't help you read records if they have no Spanish 
speaking staff.  They have many people doing extractions that don't 
speak Spanish.  
> 
> One thing I had to learn on my own is the system they use for 
surnames.  In Mexico they use both the father's surname and mother's 
surname, never just one surname.  For instance my name here is Emilie 
Garcia.  In Mexico I would be Emilia Olague Marquez de Garcia (Garcia 
is my married name--my husband would be Antonio Garcia Acosta).  
Perhaps you noticed that your father is listed in Mexico as Ramon 
Romero de la Torre, maybe even Jose Ramon Romero de la Torre (since 

here is an idea. Why not try to recruit some more people into the group
with roots in Tepatitlan de Morelos? Go to Rootsweb and to the message
boards and then in the search window enter "Tepatitlan de Morelos" and
then just plain "Tepatitlan." Have a look around for the messages of
people that seem to be serious and invite them to join Ranchos. I got
over a hundred hits on Tepatitlan and 27 for Tepatitlan de Morelos.

maybe go over to some of the other large groups and see who is
researching that area.

you say you've been to SLC, but are you ordering films and seaching them
in the family history center close to you? What city do you live in?
Where are you stuck and which type of records have you researched so far
and during what time period?

joseph




Linda R Romero wrote:

My main focus is in Jalisco - Tepatitlan de Morelos to be exact. I
have not been able to find anything farther away than that little
burg. In fact, after lurking on this list all summer, I haven't
found anyone with a connection to my Romero/de la Torre family from
that area. You are all such good researchers. I've been to SLC and
copied information from the Baptismos from Tepatitlan and am trying
to connect the Romero/de la Torre names to my family. My father was
born there but told so many "stories" the truth is hard to find. He
even had us kids claim he was born in Guatamala throughout our school
years. I found the truth when I was an adult. He also never allowed
us to learn Spanish. What a character! So I'll keep lurking and
learning from all you great researchers.

  Where do you find all that good information?

Linda Romero
  Ramon Romero/Marie L. Hallstead
     Castulo Romero/Sophia de la Torre - Donald Hallstead/Merle Beltz

Manuel Romero/Marcelina de la Torre - Jose de la Torre/Elena
Romero

My main focus is in Jalisco - Tepatitlan de Morelos to be exact. I
have not been able to find anything farther away than that little
burg. In fact, after lurking on this list all summer, I haven't
found anyone with a connection to my Romero/de la Torre family from
that area. You are all such good researchers. I've been to SLC and
copied information from the Baptismos from Tepatitlan and am trying
to connect the Romero/de la Torre names to my family. My father was
born there but told so many "stories" the truth is hard to find. He
even had us kids claim he was born in Guatamala throughout our school
years. I found the truth when I was an adult. He also never allowed
us to learn Spanish. What a character! So I'll keep lurking and
learning from all you great researchers.

  Where do you find all that good information?

Linda Romero
  Ramon Romero/Marie L. Hallstead
     Castulo Romero/Sophia de la Torre - Donald Hallstead/Merle Beltz

Manuel Romero/Marcelina de la Torre - Jose de la Torre/Elena
Romero

Romero's and de la Torres for generations. Any hints as to finding
out where this leads?