TEST SITE - DO NOT USE - Development only

Enter your vote today!  A new poll has been created for the 
ranchos group:

As Things stand now all topics are open for discussion if
they can be tied into our geography target area. . .afterall
genealogy is life and all things are included in life. Now a
suggestion has come up that we consider "one day" to be a
"free discussion day" a day free of even the above
restriction as long as it is "somehow related to our search
for our ancestors and at the same time try to learn
something about our cultures."

For this to be a valid vote I need 33% of the members to
vote yes for it. That would be 33% of 87 or 28.71 of you to
vote yes. I picked that number as a guess as to the number
of active members. I will probably pick Saturday or Sunday
to be this free day if we get the required yes votes.  

  o Seguro Que Si (yes) 
  o Oye No! (no) 
  o ¿Quien Dijo? (who said?) 
  o ¿Que? (what?) 
  o No Liase (It doesn't matter) 
  o I defer my vote to Mr. Puentes (8^) 


To vote, please visit the following web page:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ranchos/surveys?id=1717123 

Note: Please do not reply to this message. Poll votes are 
not collected via email. To vote, you must go to the Yahoo! Groups 
web site listed above.

Thanks!

 

I have eaten tamles with raisins and "dulce de viznaga" they are great
tasting. If you go to Northern Mexico, don't be surprised to find
olives in your tamal! ( Sonora)

John Gonzalez

Emilie,

Thanks for sharing your thoughts and reflections since childhood 
about Mexican history.

I have frequently wondered more or less about the same things myself, 
but more so since I started my pursuit of genealogy.  I'm sure you'll 
agree that in this sense genealogy is much more than a simple hobby.

If everyone was at least partially aware of their own genealogical 
roots we would surely have a most tolerant and peaceful world.  As 
Mexicans, most of us are the product of the clash of two opposing 
worlds and cultures.  As difficult as it is to admit the painful 
facts of our ancestral history, we have to come to terms with both 
sides of our nature, and reconcile our inner self with the past.

I believe we should trascend the feelings of guilt or remorse as much 
as we should trascend the feelings of revenge or vindictiveness.  
Whenever we instruct those that come after us and cite or expose an 
episode of our history, we should never forget that greater calling 
we have as reconcilers, as peacemakers.  The pursuit of genealogy is 
always a uniting not a dividing force!

Victor

--- In ranchos@yahoogroups.com, "Emilie Garcia" <auntyemfaustus@h...> 
wrote:
> Joseph,
> 
> I guess I have been feeling guilty about what the Conquest did to 
Mexico and South America since I was in school.  When I was little, 
in grammar school, they started to teach us about the history of 
Mexico and the Southwest, (something my father, not my mother, was 
aware of)  and when I found out what the Spaniards had done, I went 
to my father and told him that I hated every drop of Spanish blood in 
me because I thought it was terrible that the Spaniards had reduced 
the Aztecs' beautiful pyramids to rubble and built Catholic 
cathedrals on top of them.   
> 
> He told me that I shouldn't feel that way since we were Mestizos 
and the blood of both ran in our veins.  He said the Indians were 
very cruel people whose religion condoned human sacrifice.  (I think 
he even told me that women were treated very poorly by the Indians, 
whereas the Spaniards put women on a pedestal--I think he inferred 
that had the Indians won, I would be making corn tortillas in a hut 
there instead of living free here). He himself was an atheist, and he 
hated priests, but he never told me why.  He was very torn about his 
feelings for Mexico.  He had loved his childhood there, but he had 
hated the oligarchy there.  He blamed them for having to leave Mexico 

Alicia,

You beat me to the saying "El que tiene más saliva traga más pinole", 
but have you heard the one that says "No se puede chiflar y tragar 
pinole al mismo tiempo"?

I guess that's the Mexican equivalent of "you can't have your cake 
and eat it too"

Victor

--- In ranchos@yahoogroups.com, Alicia Carrillo <alliecar@p...> wrote:
> John,
>  
> Have you had atole de Pinole? If you haven''t you must try it, esta 
muy sabroso! You can make atole de pinole with milk or water or milk 
and water. Many people add sugar and cinnamon. It''s a thickened 
sweet drink usually served with tamales in the wintertime, especially 
at Christmas. Pinole comes in a dry powdered form and it takes 
moisture and heat to dissolve it. When you taste it dry because of 
it''s fine powdery consistency it can get caught in the back of your 
throat thereby inducing coughing fits.
> Have you heard the dicho or saying, El que tiene mas saliva, traga 
mas pinole? When two people engage in a verbal sparring match the one 
who comes out ahead is said to have more saliva therefore able to eat 
more pinole.
>  
> Thanks John, it had been a while since I'd thought of pinole.
> Alicia
> 

I agree, John, everyone should give pinole a try!

Tarahumaras fame as runners is well known, but I've always heard that 
they frequently use peyote, their sacred cactus, to increase their 
stamina in long distance running across the desert.  Maybe they carry 
two little pouches: one filled with pinole and one filled with peyote?

Victor

--- In ranchos@yahoogroups.com, "lrapido" <1gnzlz@v...> wrote:
> Talking about food...
> I wonder how many of our members have heard of "Pinole" ? Pinole is 
> a high energy food made from dry roasted corn ground-up and mixed 
> with brown sugar (Piloncillo, o panocha) and cinnamon and sometimes 
> either lemon or orange peel for flavoring. The Tarahumara indians 
of 
> Chihuahua use it as a staple food. Tarahumaras are basically 
> vegetarians, with meat accounting for about less than 10% of their 
> diet. They eat Pinole it or drink it ( can be mixed with water 
> or ? ) before they run the ultra marathons.  Pinole is a very 
> convinient high energy food because in its powder form can keep  
> for months. It is carried in a pouch during long trips and is 
> used to sometimes replace whole meals. The Tarahumaras are 
> universally known as runners. Tarahumaras have run the 100 mile 
> marathon from Nevada to California.  They think nothing of running 
> 50 miles or more to go visit friends or relatives in a distant 
> village.  When was the last time you did that!
> They hunt by running animals until the animal gets tired and gives 
> up. That includes deer, rabbits and whatever animal they choose to 
> chase.
>  Pinole is very sweet and very tasty. Try it, next time you go to 
> Mexico, or better yet, make your own! In Mexico it is sold at just 
> about any grocery store, kids love it, just make sure you plan a 
> high energy activity for them. If you are runner or into high 
energy 
> sports, you should give it a try. 
> 
> John Gonzalez

I have eaten tamles with raisins and "dulce de viznaga" they are great 
tasting. If you go to Northern Mexico, don't be surprised to find 
olives in your tamal! ( Sonora) 

John Gonzalez

I am sorry.
 I somehow deleted a message from a person asking about Teocaltiche
Please send the message again.  I would love to answer it.

John Gonzalez

Talking about food...
I wonder how many of our members have heard of "Pinole" ? Pinole is 
a high energy food made from dry roasted corn ground-up and mixed 
with brown sugar (Piloncillo, o panocha) and cinnamon and sometimes 
either lemon or orange peel for flavoring. The Tarahumara indians of 
Chihuahua use it as a staple food. Tarahumaras are basically 
vegetarians, with meat accounting for about less than 10% of their 
diet. They eat Pinole it or drink it ( can be mixed with water 
or ? ) before they run the ultra marathons.  Pinole is a very 
convinient high energy food because in its powder form can keep  
for months. It is carried in a pouch during long trips and is 
used to sometimes replace whole meals. The Tarahumaras are 
universally known as runners. Tarahumaras have run the 100 mile 
marathon from Nevada to California.  They think nothing of running 
50 miles or more to go visit friends or relatives in a distant 
village.  When was the last time you did that!
They hunt by running animals until the animal gets tired and gives 
up. That includes deer, rabbits and whatever animal they choose to 
chase.
 Pinole is very sweet and very tasty. Try it, next time you go to 
Mexico, or better yet, make your own! In Mexico it is sold at just 
about any grocery store, kids love it, just make sure you plan a 
high energy activity for them. If you are runner or into high energy 
sports, you should give it a try. 

John Gonzalez

 

--- In ranchos@yahoogroups.com, "Erlinda Castanon-Long" 
<longsjourney@y...> wrote:
> When I was in Mexico for the first time 2 years ago while in 
> Guadalajara our hostess stopped to buy corn tamales from a 
roadside 
> stand that she frequently buys from.  They were pure corn made 
with 
> corn oil, no meat fillers, no sause just pure corn tamale.  I had 
> never seen that before but they were very sweet just as they were.
> 
> As an American born Mexican I was surprised at all the foods I 
> didn't recognize both in Jalisco and Zacatecas.  I did find eating 
> more healthy, cooking much plainer and portions much smaller.  In 
El 
> Durazno, District of Jerez, the white cheese was delivered to the 
> door wrapped in a cloth, the corn tortillas were made by 2 local 
> women who started at 5am and closed at 8:30am.  People came by and 
> bought them by weight including just masa if they wanted to make  
> tamales.  I had never seen corn taken from the husk to a corn 
> tortilla, they let me help since I was family.. they did use a 
> machine to shape and cook them. They typically ate twice a day 
with 
> a very light dinner of chocolate and sweet bread or fruit around 
> 8pm. We were invited for lunch at 3pm and were served potatoes, 
> beans, tortillas, white cheese and a huge platter of cucumbers 
with 
> limes.  Best meal I had in Mexico! They also went to market daily 
> and fruits and veggies were fresh not canned.. we may still have a 
> lot to learn from our 3rd world neighbors..
> Linda

 Mas Tamales
It sounds like what you had to eat were "Tamales de elote" These are 
made from fresh corn instead of dried corn masa which is used  
making the regular tamales.  The secret in tamales is in the 
kneading of the dough, you got to get enough air in it so that they 
will come out fluffy and not hard like a rock. I think Lard is used
like shortening.  Have you ever tried to bake a cake with oil 
instead os shortening?  Tamales made with Manteca are going to be a 
lot tastier than tamales made with oil. Tamales are labor intensive!
that's why they are made during the holidays when families get 
together and there is plenty of help available.

I like to make a comment about your phrase: " as an American born 
Mexican"  Please! Please! people. America is a Continent, it is not 
a country. The name of this country is : The United States of 

Esperanza,

So you want to be a food anthropologist, uhh? That must be an 
interesting field!  Did you know that tamalli is Nahuatl for tamal?

You're right about the pork tamales, pork (and lard) became an 
available filling until after the Spanish colonization.  But before 
that, tamales came in a much wider variety that what we can now 
imagine, for example, tamales were made of fish, tadpoles, bees, 
honey, seeds, frogs, ants, tomato, corn, sweets, anything that was 
available at the time.

According to some, the original recipe of this millenary dish came 
out of the need to create a portable food, one that warriors could 
easily take with them to the battle fields, etc.  The tamal wrap was 
ideal as it protected and preserved the food from contamination, etc.

There is plenty of information available online if you do a search 
for a combination of keywords, like tamalli, tamal, nahuatl, masa, 
etc.

Now, speaking about the indigenous (Amerindian) diet versus what 
experts say is the "ideal diet", you have a really important point 
there.  Those of us who have partial Amerindian ancestry have our 
genetic makeup "wired up" for a low caloric intake, frugal diet, as 
our ancestors had for thousands of years.  Therefore, it is not 
unusual (or I should say it is very common) for Mexican-Americans to 
suffer from diet related diseases, like diabetes, obesity and others, 
when instead they follow the typical fatty, high calorie, American 
diet.  Statistics don't lie.  I can also see the difference between 
members of my family who have migrated to the US and those that have 
stayed in México.  The same thing is true for members of my wife's 
family.  Have you noticed anything similar?

Victor


--- In ranchos@yahoogroups.com, latina1955@a... wrote:
> I have also thought of tamales - the supposedly Indian tradition 
that was  
> passed through generations.  Did you know that food is the last 
thing to  "go" 
> in ethnic identity - which is why I should have become a food  
anthropologist - 
> my passion for history and food...
>  
> Here's the question - when I make tamales, I use a lot of lard.  
But  lard 
> comes from pork, which was really brought here from the Spanish - 
so now  the 
> "pure" Indian tamale got "mexicanized"!!! Has anyone ever come 
across  tamales 
> that were not made of lard - or is there a recipe out there that 
might  have 
> been more "indigenous" than I am aware of?  Or perhaps the 

When I was in Mexico for the first time 2 years ago while in 
Guadalajara our hostess stopped to buy corn tamales from a roadside 
stand that she frequently buys from.  They were pure corn made with 
corn oil, no meat fillers, no sause just pure corn tamale.  I had 
never seen that before but they were very sweet just as they were.

As an American born Mexican I was surprised at all the foods I 
didn't recognize both in Jalisco and Zacatecas.  I did find eating 
more healthy, cooking much plainer and portions much smaller.  In El 
Durazno, District of Jerez, the white cheese was delivered to the 
door wrapped in a cloth, the corn tortillas were made by 2 local 
women who started at 5am and closed at 8:30am.  People came by and 
bought them by weight including just masa if they wanted to make  
tamales.  I had never seen corn taken from the husk to a corn 
tortilla, they let me help since I was family.. they did use a 
machine to shape and cook them. They typically ate twice a day with 
a very light dinner of chocolate and sweet bread or fruit around 
8pm. We were invited for lunch at 3pm and were served potatoes, 
beans, tortillas, white cheese and a huge platter of cucumbers with 
limes.  Best meal I had in Mexico! They also went to market daily 
and fruits and veggies were fresh not canned.. we may still have a 
lot to learn from our 3rd world neighbors..
Linda