TEST SITE - DO NOT USE - Development only

Hi Alberto,
In my family in Jerez Zacatecas the Mulato's were assimillated and 
through the years by marrying into Espanol and Mestizo families they 
eventually thought they were Espanol and Mestizo only.

My Alcala family records show them as Alcalan and Mulato Libre or 
Indio depending on which brothers marriage record you read in late 
1700's. They come to Jerez by way of Valparaiso and Fresnillo to 
live in Labor de Marquez by 1780. By 1815 my direct ancestor Marcial 
Alcala had married an Espanol woman and therafter they thought of 
themselves as Espanol! 
Abt. 1865 my ancestor Maria Marcos Alcala married Ambrocio Caldera 
and the Caldera family always said they were Espanol. If I remember 
correctly you and I share the Caldera line.  I have found 1 record 
that suggests that the Garcia line married into the Caldera lines 
twice in late 1700's were also Indio and possibly Mulato, the record 
refers to him as Collote... I have the Garcia line in at least 2 of 
my lines.

When my father visited El Durazno, Jerez in 1836 he was asked if 
there really were people with black skins in California? They said 
they had never seen such a person and knew nothing of the history of 
slavery in their own community. It's nice to reclaim through 
genealogy the people who got me here..
Linda in Everett.

Interesting point...
Regarding the mulato slave, my uncle bought a mulata
slave with a young child in the Jerez slave market,
circa 1732,  what ever happened to all the slaves that
were set free, later on?  I'm sure they just didn't
disappeared.  I believe they were assimilated among
us.

Alberto Duarte Prieto
Santa Maria, California

--- Erlinda Castanon-Long <longsjourney@...>
wrote:

> My family did this too.  My mothers brother is
> married to my fathers 
> sister. My aunt and uncle never had children but we
> often joke that 
> thier kids would have looked just like my brother,
> sister and I! It 
> took years for my maternal grandmother to get over
> this, my maternal 
> line is fair skinned with blue eyes and my paternal
> line is dark 
> skinned. I believe my grandmother picked up her
> attitudes about skin 
> color in Mexico.  Her fist question with
> grandchildren was always 
> about their skin  and eye color.. This is also the
> grandmother who's 
> line is where I found my Mulato slave line... I
> honestly don't think 
> she knew...
> 
> In Tamazula Jalisco, my maternal grandfather's
> sister Rosa married his 
> mother in laws brother Maximiano years before he
> married my 
> grandmother. I'd have to assume that's how he met my
> grandmother... My 
> aunt had photos that say these were the children of
> Maximiano and Rosa 
> but no thought to mention they were double related. 
> It seemed to be 
> norm in Mexico for there to be 20 year spans between
> first and last 
> child so the age differences bring suitors that are
> family or friends 
> from more than one generation.  When I have no ages
> I try to put at 
> least 20 or 25 years for aprox. birth date but then
> I find a record of 
> a 42 year old widower marrying a 14 year old girl 3
> months after his 
> wife dies in childbirth with their 14th child.  They
> then go on to 
> have another 11 children. Can you just imagine being
> a mother of 14 at 
> age 14! That had to  be an arrainged marriage.
> Linda in Everett
> 
> 
> 
> 


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My family did this too.  My mothers brother is married to my fathers 
sister. My aunt and uncle never had children but we often joke that 
thier kids would have looked just like my brother, sister and I! It 
took years for my maternal grandmother to get over this, my maternal 
line is fair skinned with blue eyes and my paternal line is dark 
skinned. I believe my grandmother picked up her attitudes about skin 
color in Mexico.  Her fist question with grandchildren was always 
about their skin  and eye color.. This is also the grandmother who's 
line is where I found my Mulato slave line... I honestly don't think 
she knew...

In Tamazula Jalisco, my maternal grandfather's sister Rosa married his 
mother in laws brother Maximiano years before he married my 
grandmother. I'd have to assume that's how he met my grandmother... My 
aunt had photos that say these were the children of Maximiano and Rosa 
but no thought to mention they were double related.  It seemed to be 
norm in Mexico for there to be 20 year spans between first and last 
child so the age differences bring suitors that are family or friends 
from more than one generation.  When I have no ages I try to put at 
least 20 or 25 years for aprox. birth date but then I find a record of 
a 42 year old widower marrying a 14 year old girl 3 months after his 
wife dies in childbirth with their 14th child.  They then go on to 
have another 11 children. Can you just imagine being a mother of 14 at 
age 14! That had to  be an arrainged marriage.
Linda in Everett

This is a common occurence in my family.  A set of brothers married to 
a set of sisters or brother/sister married to sister/brother.  I even 
have a marriage extraction from my 6th great-grandfather who was 
married in a double cermony.  He and his brother married a set of 
sisters.

I imagine that, part of this is due to arranged marriages...well not in 
the traditional sense.  In the case when one set marries first then 
they introduce (or setup) the second set to one another and they too 
end up gettting married.

I myself, have many 'double first cousins'.  I think it happens more 
often then people realize.  Considering the term 'double first cousin' 
can be found in genelaogy literature.  It must come up often enough for 
them to create a term for it. :)  But I imagine it happened more often 
in the small towns...not so much today.

Angie

--- In ranchos@yahoogroups.com, "John Gonzalez" <1gnzlz@v...> wrote:
>
> Correction:
> 
> In my family tree I have:  Four, first cousins, who are  sisters.  
The first two sisters married two brothers, and the other two sisters 
are also married to brothers.   The first two brothers are not "blood 
related" to the second set of brothers.   Can you beat that?.  They all 
live in the Sacramento area.
> 
> John Gonzalez
> Wildomar, CA.
> 
> 1gnzlz@v...
>

Emilie,

Yeah, I am familar with naming children based on the Saint's Feast 
day.  And given that it makes it even harder to believe.  Two people 
born on the same day or give or take a day and they get married.  
Well, I guess that isn't unheard of, I have an aunt and her husband 
who share a birthday (they have different first names).

I have over 7000 names in my family tree program and it feels like a 
large number of them have the same first name with their spouse... 
but I probably exaggerate.  I wonder if its possible to print out a 
list...

I am able to print them by birthdate and matching names almost always 
line up... 

Thanks,
Angie

FYI: For anyone interested:
Saint Calendar - 
http://www.catholic.org/saints/calendar/december.php
     or
Feastday List - 
http://www.catholic.org/saints/f_day/dec.php

Names can be used to approximate birthdays...help you look in the 
right month...to find a relatative birth/christening.

--- In ranchos@yahoogroups.com, "Emilie Garcia" <auntyemfaustus@h...> 
wrote:
>
> Angie,
> 
> People used to be named according to the Calendar of Saints, no?  
My mother always spoke about her "saint day" and other people's.  
Everyone's saint day seemed to be a big deal then (my mother was born 
in 1902) and parties were held, sort of like birthday parties, only 
you celebrated the day that saint was on some calendar.  She was 
Luisa and guys named Luis celebrated their saint day at the same 
time.  she didn't marry a Luis though.  Could it be that young people 
met at church on their saint day, got acquainted and visited each 
other later?
> 
> Emilie Garcia
> Port Orchard, WA --

Maybe.  But even now, many young people met in church
and eventually get married that have different names. 
I believe many marriages were arranged by the parents
during the time of our grandparents.

Alberto Duarte Prieto
Santa Maria, California

--- Emilie Garcia <auntyemfaustus@...> wrote:

> Angie,
> 
> People used to be named according to the Calendar of
> Saints, no?  My mother always spoke about her "saint
> day" and other people's.  Everyone's saint day
> seemed to be a big deal then (my mother was born in
> 1902) and parties were held, sort of like birthday
> parties, only you celebrated the day that saint was
> on some calendar.  She was Luisa and guys named Luis
> celebrated their saint day at the same time.  she
> didn't marry a Luis though.  Could it be that young
> people met at church on their saint day, got
> acquainted and visited each other later?
> 
> Emilie Garcia
> Port Orchard, WA --
>   ----- Original Message ----- 
>   From: John Gonzalez<mailto:1gnzlz@...> 
>   To:
>
ranchos@yahoogroups.com<mailto:ranchos@yahoogroups.com>
> 
>   Sent: Monday, December 19, 2005 10:56 AM
>   Subject: Re: [ranchos] Re: Godina Family
> 
> 
>   Angie:
> 
>   Re: Similiar names, you are not alone.
> 
>   What about fathers naming theirs sons after
> themselves?   I've four : Juan Gonzalez de
> Hermosillo!
> 
>   1gnzlz@...<mailto:1gnzlz@...>
>     ----- Original Message ----- 
>     From: aajay1073<mailto:aajay1073@...> 
>     To:
>
ranchos@yahoogroups.com<mailto:ranchos@yahoogroups.com>
> 
> 
>     To the Group,
>     Off topic...is it just my family or has anyone
> else noticed that 
>     people tended to marry people with similar
> names, ie Gregorio married 
>     Gregoria.  I have lots of Antonio's married to
> Antonia's, Felipe's 
>     married to Felipa's, ...the list goes on...
> 
>     Angie Godina
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>   SPONSORED LINKS
>

aajay1073 wrote:

To the Group,

Off topic...is it just my family or has anyone else noticed that
people tended to marry people with similar names, ie Gregorio married
Gregoria. I have lots of Antonio's married to Antonia's, Felipe's
married to Felipa's, ...the list goes on...

I've noticed the same thing with some of my Francisco/Francisca,
Antonio/Antonia, In my situation I don't see it that often but
occasionally.

joseph

John,

Well, I am glad you are having success with Legacy...

Sorry, but Gregorio Godina and Gregoria Martinez don't sound 
familar.  The only Gregorio Godina I have in my family tree was 
married to Maria Remigia Huerta on 14 DEC 1808.  His birth must have 
been between 1771-1790.  His parents were Mauricio Casimiro Godina 
Cardenas christened on 4 JUN 1742 and married to Maria Rosalia de la 
Luz Texeda on 13 MAR 1771.  I am actually only related to these 
Godina's through the Cardenas family.  I have been trying to tie my 
Godina line to this line without success.  I am more closely related 
to Maria Remigia Huerta who's parents are Jose Guadalupe Huerta 
married to Juana Maria Sandoval Castaneda christened on 23 MAR 1770 
and married on 8 MAR 1788.  This last couple are my 4th great-grand 
parents.

To the Group,
Off topic...is it just my family or has anyone else noticed that 
people tended to marry people with similar names, ie Gregorio married 
Gregoria.  I have lots of Antonio's married to Antonia's, Felipe's 
married to Felipa's, ...the list goes on...

Angie Godina


--- In ranchos@yahoogroups.com, "John Gonzalez" <1gnzlz@v...> wrote:
>
> Hi  Angie:
> 
> Thank you for the information and I appreciate the time you have 
taken to look at this problem.   I 'll give it a try.
> 
>   I believe I've found something easier and better, I switched from 
PAF-5 to Legacy!  WOW, what a differenc like going from driving a 
Ford  to a Cadillac!  This program is loaded with features not found 
in PAF-5 , and the best part of it is,  that it is FREE.  Now all I 
have to do is spend a few hours learning this new program.
> 
> While I am here...I've started looking for my maternal side of the 
family.  My grandfather's name was Priciliano Cerros Godina.  I've 
been able to follow his mother's side , Victoriana Godina, all the 
way back to Gregorio Godina, born in 1814 and married to Gregoria 
Martinez in Colotlan, Jalisco on 27, Aug, 1834.  I am hoping to 
follow the Cerro line but have encountered some difficulites with my 
great grandfather:  Jose Maria Cerro, married to Victoriana Godina.  
I am waiting for a film from LDS to check his marriage.
> 
> Does any of this sounds familiar to you?
> 
> John Gonzalez
> Wildomar, CA.
> 
> 1gnzlz@v...

I am interested in getting this book please send info on how to get it with cost

thanks Jose

John,

I have had the same problem.  If you print directly it comes out 
fine, so its kind of odd that it doesn't work when you print to file.

My solution has been.  Open the document in Microsoft Word.  Place 
the cursor at the end of the document.  Create a page break if you 
want the index to appear on a new page.  Select the 'Insert' menu, 
then the 'Reference' option, then the 'Index and Tables...' option.  
Select the options you want to see in your index.  Specifically the 
way you want your index formatted.  Test out a couple of options, to 
see what you like...

Hope this information helps...

Good Luck,
Angie Godina

P.S.  This is my second try at a response...the first time my browser 
errored out and closed itself...therefore if this message ends up 
being a duplicate...sorry...oh well...

--- In ranchos@yahoogroups.com, "John Gonzalez" <1gnzlz@v...> wrote:
>
> Do we have a PAF Guru in the group?  I need some help. PLEASE  I 
know 
> we have a number of members using PAF, I am hoping somebody can 
help me.
> 
> I am trying to create a file using the "Books"option and would like 
to 
> include an index to go along with it.
> 
> I can create the file and its index by selecting the "Print to a 
file" 
> option and by selecting the "index" option also. I preview it,  
then I 
> save it, but when I look at the saved file, the index is missing!
> 
> What am I doing wrong?  Any ideas?  Can it be a limitation to this 
> program?  I have tried using Wordpad and also Microsoft Word to 
look at 
> the saved file, same results.
> 
> Any help or suggestions will be appreciated.
> Thank you. 
> 
> John Gonzalez
> Wildomar CA.
>

The surnames Romero de Chavez, Torre-Ledesma, and Torres will be 
published in Tomo IV.  The only volumes that were ever published 
originally were I and II. 

Maria

--- In ranchos@yahoogroups.com, Linda R Romero <romero89@e...> wrote:
>
> Will you please check for my family names from Jalisco??  They are  
> Romero and de la Torre from the Guadalajara and Tepatitlan areas 
of  
> Jalisco.  I'm not sure if they started there or moved there from  
> other areas. They were there at least from the mid to late 1800's.
> 
> Thank you for your help.
> 
> Linda Romero
> 
> 
> Maria Cortez wrote:
>    The books cover the first Spanish settlers of Los Altos de 
Jalisco.
> Some families do extend to other states, so you might find some of
> your ancestry covered in one of the chapters.  I have a copy of Tomo
> I which contains a "Plan general de la obra" for all the subsequent
> Tomos (II - VI) and has all the surnames covered.  If anyone wants 
me
> to check for any surnames send me an e-mail.
> 
> Each chapter begins with the first settlers and then traces their
> male descendancy. Sources are cited for every bit of data.
> 
> Maria Cortez
>

John,

If you can't wait for the PAF software team to find a solution, I
recommend you download the free edition of Legacy Family Tree.  You
can import your gedcom file and then print the same kind of book report.

http://www.legacyfamilytree.com/

Victor

--- In ranchos@yahoogroups.com, "John Gonzalez" <1gnzlz@v...> wrote:
>
> Thank you for taking the time to look into the problem.  I was
thinking the same thing that you are, that it could be a software problem
> with PAF 5. 
> 1gnzlz@v...