TEST SITE - DO NOT USE - Development only

Joseph,
If all are in agreement I think this is a good idea.  You can count me for a $25 pledge.

Olivia
So. Calif.

Joseph Puentes <makas@...> wrote:

For now we are over a hundred members strong. I would like to run
something past you that is open for discussion. Would anyone object to
having a completely optional "Ranchos Support Fund"?

I was thinking if a few of us sent in a few buck we might be able to
have $100 stipends available to send off to members that are in need or
for projects that are supportive of the Ranchos Group. This effort would
need a volunteer "use" committee which would have at least 3 members (no
ties) and one of those would be a treasurer to hold the funds. Before
the "use" committee would decide on a "use" they would bring up the use
for group discussion. but after the discussion the decision for the use
would be made by the committee.

If this is something that you all would consider going forward on then I
would like to nominate Kitty Cortez to
be one of the committee members
and possibly the Treasurer. Also I would like to pledge $25 to start the
contributions.

But all that is premature if you all think this is not something worthwhile.

what say ye?

joseph

---

Yahoo! Music Unlimited - Access over 1 million songs. Try it free.

While digging my roots I came across this: " Br. Pbro. Diego Gonzalez 
de Hermosillo. "

I know what Pbro. means: Presbitero. But what is the Br. stands for? 

I know it is a religious title.  Is there any member out there that has 
any idea or can suggest a resource to look it up?  Any help will be 
greatly appreciated.  The subject was my gggggg Grandfather from 
Jalostotitlan, Jalisco. 

--- In ranchos@yahoogroups.com, Joseph Puentes <makas@n...> wrote:
>
> 
> All the Colotlan and nearby area researchers of this group. Help me come 
> up with some interview questions for these Historiadores.
> 
> what do you want to know?
> 
> joseph
> 
> 
 
1. What is the mining history of Colotlan?
2. Were the inhabitants of Colotlan and nearby areas migratory in nature, looking for the 
best jobs they could?
3. Did the Native American Indians of Colotlan survive? Are they still there?
4. Is it true the haciendas turned over every three generations?
5. What percent of the population in the 1700's and 1800's actually lived in the "city", like 
Colotlan vis-á-vis on the small ranches/haciendas?
6. How did Colotlan compare in the 1700's and 1800's to the major cities of Guadalajuara 
and Mexico City?
7. Who were the important figures in Colotlan history, both Spanish and Native American 
Indian?
8. How much influence did the Catholic Church have in the area? How much land did the 
Catholic church own or control before the land reforms of the 1850's?
9. Why was Colotlan originally chosen as a site for colonization by the Spanish?
10. When did the Spanish first come in force to the area? Were there distinct "waves" of 
immigration? Where did these Spaniards come from---provinces?
11. Is Colotlan today a prosperous city? If so, why? If not, why not?
12. Does a large percentage of the young people in Colotlan emigrate to USA today? If so, 
why?
13. Is "status" in Colotlan and the nearby area based on race or money or family history?
14. Is the area still Catholic?


Basta.

Ed

make sure you click on the whole name - both lines are part of the
address. Type in the second line if you have to - it's worth it.

Happy Thanksgiving

Linda
Message: 6
   Date: Fri, 25 Nov 2005 08:18:42 -0600
   From: Linda R Romero <romero89@...>
Subject: Re: Digest Number 673

Happy Thanksgiving all.

Turn on sound.

http://www.msn.americangreetings.com/view.pd?
i=382219626&m=1652&rr=y&source=msne999

Happy Thanksgiving all.

Turn on sound.

http://www.msn.americangreetings.com/view.pd?
i=382219626&m=1652&rr=y&source=msne999

Joseph

A shot on initals M.E.ad   Medico Especialista
Administrador

Jose Munoz

--- Joseph Puentes <makas@...> wrote:

> In that death cert for my GGG grandfather, Tadeo
> Diaz. What do you think 
> the letters mean on the left:
> 
> M. E. ad ? is it ad or something else. I would guess
> the E is for 
> Espanol but what about the M and ad?
> 
> joseph
> 
> 



	
		
__________________________________ 
Yahoo! Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005 
http://mail.yahoo.com

I will pledge $100. Let me know when and where to send it.

Ed

--- In ranchos@yahoogroups.com, Mary Allen <mary.allen3770@s...> wrote:
>
> A good idea. I pledge $25.00.   Mary Garana Allen
> 
> Richard and Kitty Cortez <kcortez@s...> wrote:Joseph, when I was working I was in charge 
of the weekly football 
> pool, so I feel I could handle the Ranchos Support Fund if we decide 
> to go thru with this.  Thank you for your confidence in my ability.  
> Rich and I can also pledge $25.00

Joseph, when I was working I was in charge of the weekly football 
pool, so I feel I could handle the Ranchos Support Fund if we decide 
to go thru with this.  Thank you for your confidence in my ability.  
Rich and I can also pledge $25.00, but let it be known that others 
can pledge $1.00, $10.00 or whatever they feel comfortable.  Some of 
us retired folks are on fixed incomes. 

Happy Thanksgiving to all

Kitty
Rocklin, CA



--- In ranchos@yahoogroups.com, Joseph Puentes <makas@n...> wrote:
>
> For now we are over a hundred members strong.  I would like to run 
> something past you that is open for discussion. Would anyone 
object to 
> having a completely optional "Ranchos Support Fund"?
> 
> I was thinking if a few of us sent in a few buck we might be able 
to 
> have $100 stipends available to send off to members that are in 
need or 
> for projects that are supportive of the Ranchos Group. This effort 
would 
> need a volunteer "use" committee which would have at least 3 
members (no 
> ties) and one of those would be a treasurer to hold the funds. 
Before 
> the "use" committee would decide on a "use" they would bring up 
the use 
> for group discussion. but after the discussion the decision for 
the use 
> would be made by the committee.
> 
> If this is something that you all would consider going forward on 
then I 
> would like to nominate Kitty Cortez to be one of the committee 
members 
> and possibly the Treasurer. Also I would like to pledge $25 to 
start the 
> contributions.
> 
> But all that is premature if you all think this is not something 
worthwhile.
> 
> what say ye?
> 
> joseph
>

The time and date are:  December 3rd at 11:30 am.

You are all invited.  If any of you get the urge to hop on a plane 
and meet us in Sacramento you are more than welcome.

Maria

--- In ranchos@yahoogroups.com, robert hernandez <tehuima2@y...> 
wrote:
>
>   The Sacramento meeting place is Vallejo's Restaurant 1331 O 
street (14th and O). Attached is a link to a map. When you open link 
just plug in your specific starting address. This should render turn 
by turn directions. By the way, the owner is from Jalostitlan and 
proud of it.
>   
>  
>   http://www.mapquest.com/maps/map.adp?address=14th%20St%20%26%20O%
20St&city=Sacramento&state=CA&zipcode=95814&country=US&title=14th%
20St%20%26amp%3b%20O%20St%20Sacramento%2c%20CA%2095814%2c%
20US&cid=lfmaplink2
> 
> 
> readysetgo95814 <mcortez3@g...> wrote:
>   Robert, Irma and Alicia:
> 
> I am just delighted to have enough interest.  I think we should 
time 
> it around Alicia's schedule since she is the one who has the longer 
> drive.  I'll coordinate with Alicia for a time and date and get 
back 
> to the rest of the group.
> 
> Maria
> 
> -- In ranchos@yahoogroups.com, robert hernandez <tehuima2@y...> 
wrote:
> >
> > Sign me up . . I actually live in Sacramento . . .I
> > don't mind doing the logistics . . .just give me a
> > time and date . . .
> > 
> > --- Alicia Carrillo <alliecar@p...> wrote:
> > 
> > > Maria,
> > >  
> > > I would love to meet with you and anyone else in the
> > > group. I go up there once or twice a month as my
> > > daughter lives in Roseville, my mom in Citrus
> > > Heights, my sister in Auburn and my brother in
> > > Carmichael, all within close proximity of
> > > Sacaramento.
> > >  
> > > Thanks for the invite, let me know where and when.
> > >  
> > > Hasta luego...........Alicia Carrillo de San Jose,
> > > Ca
> > > 
> > > readysetgo95814 <mcortez3@g...> wrote:
> > > In reading Alicia's note about meeting in person I
> > > was reminded of a 
> > > conversation I recently had with my prima Anna. 
> > > There are several of 

Ed/Alberto:

As an aside, the Mexican presidential mansion in Chapultepec is 
called "Los Pinos"

I too recall reading about the heavy logging that occured in the 
Sierra de Mixton near Tlaltenango early on and I know that today this 
is one of the central problems that the Wirrarika (Huichol) have with 
incursion on their lands... illegal logging.  The Sierra Huichol is 
perhaps one of the few dense forests left in the area... largely 
because of inaccessability.

Also, as another aside... the currently mainstream reason for the 
collpse of Maya civilaztion is deforestation.  The population had 
grown so dense that vast parts of the Yucatan and Guatemala were 
cleared for agriculture leading to all sorts of ecological problems 
which eventually led to catastrophe and the abandonment of the cities.

So the Spanish were not the only ones who were careless with natural 
resources.

The U.S. lumber industry is heavily pushing U.S.-style residential 
construction in Mexico in hopes that it will raise demand for U.S. 
produced lumber.  Currently most construction in Mexico is concrete 
and block, as opposed to wood framing.

Canada is actually the number one destination of U.S. wood products, 
though on a net basis we are an importer of wood products from 
Canada, but a lot of U.S. wood crossed the border for processing, etc.

Japan is number two and so far this year, China has overtaken Mexico 
for the number three position:

In millions of US Dollars

         fy03  fy04 ytd04 ytd05
Canada  1,216 1,328 1,005 1,042   3.7%
Japan     582   648   486   424 -12.8% 
Mexico    315   362   269   294   9.4% 
China     208   306   234   312  33.6% 


--- In ranchos@yahoogroups.com, Alberto Duarte <albertodua@y...> 
wrote:
>
> Not surprisingly, Mexico is one of the two biggest
> customers for our forest products.  Japan, I believe
> is number one.
> 
> Alberto Duarte
> Santa Maria, California
> 
> --- Edward Serros <ed@s...> wrote:
> 
> > Arturo,
> > 
> > In my readings on Mexico, I have been impressed with
> > the deforestation of the ranchos 
> > areas and farther north. All of this excessive
> > deforestation may partly account for the 
> > present "low yield" nature of the land, not that it
> > was real good anyway. It reminds me of 
> > the cedars of Lebanon, which used to cover Lebanon.
> > Now Lebanon has nothing to speak 

Not surprisingly, Mexico is one of the two biggest
customers for our forest products.  Japan, I believe
is number one.

Alberto Duarte
Santa Maria, California

--- Edward Serros <ed@...> wrote:

> Arturo,
> 
> In my readings on Mexico, I have been impressed with
> the deforestation of the ranchos 
> areas and farther north. All of this excessive
> deforestation may partly account for the 
> present "low yield" nature of the land, not that it
> was real good anyway. It reminds me of 
> the cedars of Lebanon, which used to cover Lebanon.
> Now Lebanon has nothing to speak 
> of since most, if not all, of the trees were used in
> various projects, including ship-
> building, centuries ago. Any comments?
> 
> Our Spanish ancestors had only one thing in mind
> sometimes: gold. Unfortunately, the 
> environmental impact may have been huge and
> deleterious.
> 
> Oh yeah, our Spanish ancestors had another thing on
> their mind: women.
> 
> Ed
> 
> --- In ranchos@yahoogroups.com, "Arturo Ramos"
> <arturo.ramos2@v...> wrote:
> >
> > Joseph et al:
> > 
> > I have been working on a lumber case for the past
> four years and know 
> > way more that I ever cared to know about species
> of trees, so when I 
> > saw your question I got curious.  I know from
> having been in Jalisco 
> > that the mountainous areas are a mix of coniferous
> and deciduous 
> > forests, and that the plains are grasslands but
> this gives all of the 
> > details of the extent of those ecoregions as well
> as the actual 
> > species that grow there.  Pinus Montezumae... cool
> name... also known 
> > as Ocote as in Ocotlan, Jalisco (which literally
> means the place of 
> > Montezuma pines).
> > 
> > "Pine forests in Mexico grow at elevations of
> 2,275-2,600 m and are 
> > composed mainly of Pinus montezumae."
> > 
> >
>
http://www.vivanatura.org/Maps%20Mexican%20ecosystems.html
> > 
> > The following website from Semarnat (Secretariat
> of Environment and 
> > Natural Reources) gives more details on all the
> major commericalized 
> > plant species in Mexico:
> > 

Arturo,

In my readings on Mexico, I have been impressed with the deforestation of the ranchos 
areas and farther north. All of this excessive deforestation may partly account for the 
present "low yield" nature of the land, not that it was real good anyway. It reminds me of 
the cedars of Lebanon, which used to cover Lebanon. Now Lebanon has nothing to speak 
of since most, if not all, of the trees were used in various projects, including ship-
building, centuries ago. Any comments?

Our Spanish ancestors had only one thing in mind sometimes: gold. Unfortunately, the 
environmental impact may have been huge and deleterious.

Oh yeah, our Spanish ancestors had another thing on their mind: women.

Ed

--- In ranchos@yahoogroups.com, "Arturo Ramos" <arturo.ramos2@v...> wrote:
>
> Joseph et al:
> 
> I have been working on a lumber case for the past four years and know 
> way more that I ever cared to know about species of trees, so when I 
> saw your question I got curious.  I know from having been in Jalisco 
> that the mountainous areas are a mix of coniferous and deciduous 
> forests, and that the plains are grasslands but this gives all of the 
> details of the extent of those ecoregions as well as the actual 
> species that grow there.  Pinus Montezumae... cool name... also known 
> as Ocote as in Ocotlan, Jalisco (which literally means the place of 
> Montezuma pines).
> 
> "Pine forests in Mexico grow at elevations of 2,275-2,600 m and are 
> composed mainly of Pinus montezumae."
> 
> http://www.vivanatura.org/Maps%20Mexican%20ecosystems.html
> 
> The following website from Semarnat (Secretariat of Environment and 
> Natural Reources) gives more details on all the major commericalized 
> plant species in Mexico:
> 
> http://www.semarnat.gob.mx/pfnm/amplia.html
> 

Joseph et al:

I have been working on a lumber case for the past four years and know 
way more that I ever cared to know about species of trees, so when I 
saw your question I got curious.  I know from having been in Jalisco 
that the mountainous areas are a mix of coniferous and deciduous 
forests, and that the plains are grasslands but this gives all of the 
details of the extent of those ecoregions as well as the actual 
species that grow there.  Pinus Montezumae... cool name... also known 
as Ocote as in Ocotlan, Jalisco (which literally means the place of 
Montezuma pines).

"Pine forests in Mexico grow at elevations of 2,275-2,600 m and are 
composed mainly of Pinus montezumae."

http://www.vivanatura.org/Maps%20Mexican%20ecosystems.html

The following website from Semarnat (Secretariat of Environment and 
Natural Reources) gives more details on all the major commericalized 
plant species in Mexico:

http://www.semarnat.gob.mx/pfnm/amplia.html

--- In ranchos@yahoogroups.com, Joseph Puentes <makas@n...> wrote:
>
> 
> 
> Edward Serros wrote:
> 
> >Joseph,
> >
> >Just trying to dull your "ax". I don't want you swing too hard and 
hurt yourself.
> >
> I'm an old woodsman from way back. I used to and still do heat a 
> majority of the time with a wood insert and split wood. One way to 
keep 
> from hurting yourself is to keep your Ax razor honed to make sure 
it 
> "bites" and doesn't glance off like a dull Ax is likely to do and 
catch 
> a leg. My Ax is currently ready to go, but I'm really expecting 
that 
> most on the Ax list will communicate and not stay on the list.
> 
> thanks for your concern, just trying to be fair to all.
> 
> joseph
> 
> ps: in an effort to keep this on topic, what kind of trees do they 
have 
> in Jalisco, Zacatecas and Aguascalientes.
> 
> pps: well here is a better effort. Check out this death cert for my 
GGG 
> grandfather. It seems he was a woodman too, but unfortunately he 
got in 
> the way of a Palo. That almost happened to me once. And it was one 
big palo!
> 
> >Ed
> >  
> >
>