TEST SITE - DO NOT USE - Development only

who before me lent the necessary consent

(Who gave me the necessary consent)

Hi Victoria,

Some aditional information: My mom’s maiden surname is Medina, if you consult the FamilySearch link that Manny sent you, you will find the ancestors from José Antonio Medina and going up 5 generations you will find Luis de Medina del Rincon y Romero Gutierrez y Valdivia, born in 1589 in Aguascalientes, who is my direct ancestor (11 generations).

Luis de Medina del Rincon married Maria Fernandez de Vaulus de Siordia y Navarro y Arias de Sotelo (María Fernández Vaulus in Family Search), she is the grand daugther of Petronila de Moctezuma who is believed to be descendant from Moctezuma II Xocoyotzin. But there is no full evidence.

Jorge Minchaca Medina

Hi Victoria,

I also have a lot of Romo de Vivar ancestors, eventhough I'm not descendant from José Romo de Vivar and Juana Maria Lopez de Nava.

I'm not as good as Manny and Rick but I have made some research about the Romo de Vivar. They had a lot of children and of course the fornames were sometimes repeated, therefore I like to search for the complete names.

According to my research, the complete names are: Juan's father: Joseph Ygnacio Romo de Vivar Lopez and his grandfather: Pedro Joseph Francisco Xavier Romo de Vivar y Muñoz de la Barba.

Furthermore, Pedro Joseph Francisco Xavier is the son of Cristobal Romo de Vivar Delgado (born in 1685) and Maria Muñoz de la Barba Escoto.

I wish you to enjoy your research.

Jorge Minchaca

Your welcome Victoria.   My mom’s maiden surname is Romo.  Her father, my maternal grandfather, is a third cousin of Santo Toribio Romo.   

and I also thank you Manny Diez Hermosillo, keep up the great work,

Rick A. Ricci

Jose Romo de Vivar and Maria del Carmen Ramirez were married 1/Dec/1804 in Aguascalientes.

Jose Romo de Vivar is the son of Jose Romo de Vivar y Muñoz de La Barba and Juana Maria López de Nava.

Maria del Carmen Ramirez is the daughter of Pioquinto Ramirez and Maria Guadalupe Cobos.

Reymundo Velsaco married Mariana Medina on 3/Mar/1821.

Reymundo Velasco is the son of Juan Velasco and Dolores López.

Mariana is the daughter of Jose Antonio Medina and Josefa (? Gómez or Gama, )

Rick A. Ricci

Hello Victoria,

That information can be found on FamilySearch.org, which is a free website (you only have to register with them). According to their marriage record, his parents were Jose Romo and Carmen Ramirez, and hers were Reymundo Velasco and Mariana Medina:

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:DW78-C9ZM

Saludos!
Manny Díez Hermosillo

Hola Tristan,

Others have researched the Monje de Leon/Alvarez Corona families. Silvia H. Corona comes to mind, and has published many studies available online. I’ve also posted some work I’ve done on this family here at NR: https://nuestrosraices.com/en/node/25061
That document from August 1594 isn’t Catalina de Leon’s testamento, it’s regarding her late husband’s estate. Throughout that document, Catalina Corona is identified as their daughter and heir. She was already married to Cosme Lopez and said that she was over the age of 24 years.
Catalina Corona is also mentioned in the testamento of her half-sister, Mariana Osorio, who was daughter of Catalina de Leon from her first marriage, to Cristobal de Giron Osorio, in which she identifies Catalina Corona, wife of Cosme Lopez, as her sister. She also bequeaths a slave named Maria to her niece, Doña Jusepa Corona, though she doesn’t say whose daughter Jusepa is. She also mentions another niece - a nun named Josepha de Jesus: https://www

Very interesting lead! Initially I too thought it seemed a bit far fetched however after connecting some dots I now think this has some traction! 

From what we do know, in 1641, around 10+ years after our ancestors Pedro Nieto and Josefa Corona married, they convened to the justices to affirm their marriage dowry. Josefa’s dowry was given to Pedro by Nicolas de Urdiales (Valdes) and his wife Catalina Lopez Corona! The sudden apparent need for it to be in written form was to “maintain the peace, amicability, and ensure no fraud to the dowry givers.” A second document confirms the receipt of the dowry, shedding light that it was originally agreed upon in 1630. The dowry was valued at 4,200 pesos and was loaded with goodies like; 

-a pair of blue silk sheets

-2 pink goatskin pillows with floral designs from Ruan

-5 Agnus Dei (cordero de Dios/lamb of God figurines) ornate with gold, feathers, and pearls

-10 spoons and 1 large ladle all minted of silver

-a decorative ornate salt shaker 

The

Wow. If I had seen the relationships given here on an online family tree, you know, one of those sourceless trees on which the relationships are based purely on matching names&surnames, I’d have ignored this. But this is the actual description of the contents of an actual file catalogued at an actual government archive; unless the documents are doctored, there is no reason to doubt the veracity of the relationships given. 
Many of us have wondered whether Josefa Corona descended from Martin Monje cc Isabel Alvarez Corona, and if so, how? This appears to confirm that, and reveals how. And you’re right, times & locations do match: a limpieza & probanza done for Josefa Corona cc Pedro Nieto in 1646, and the power of attorney to do so granted to her cousin, Lic. Martin de Leon (son of Pedro Villanueva and Beatriz Corona, who was sister of Catalina Corona), and before Francisco Morales (escribano publico and alguacil mayor in Sierra de Pinos). Btw, the name of the ancestor who was granted an

My reading is:  Pioquinto (Pío Quinto)

The couple is also mentioned in these sources:

• https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:6MH4-PG6Z
• https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:6M4T-KVPZ

There was a Simon Baez, who along with Antonio Lopez Merino, was arrested regarding the discovery of some skeletal remains on the latter’s ranch, on 15 Sep 1655, in San Luis Potosi. He was age 37 (b. 1618), spaniard, mayordomo of Capitan Juan Caballero, on this one’s ranch in Valle de Mexquitic. He couldn’t sign his name, so he wasn't schooled. There’s no mention of his marital status, but he had a brother named Francisco Baez, who also lived in the area. One of the victims was Simon Baez’s Indian criada, named Melchora, who had run away with the other victim (Juanillo, indio criado de Antonio Lopez Merino). Simon Baez admitted to having had an illicit relationship with Melchora, that ran for some 3 years, up to the day that she fled. It was reported that, while chasing after the fleeing Indians, he had become so enraged, that he threatened to kill them, if they caught up with them. For this reason he was held under suspicion. He was acquitted of all charges and released: https://www

This book has much valuable information.  However, I recall that it had a few mistakes in it where they wrongly identified a few people with other people of similar names.  I think I found four mistakes.  So be careful when using this book as a source.

Rick A. Ricci

Thanks for the kind words Joseph!   There is so much info that has been contributed to this site by the membership for over 22 years now!  I am a little bit selfish in wanting to keep the site running, so others can enjoy it (and learn) as much as I do. There are some excellent researchers that participate via this site; and I am always grateful to contribute where I can. 

Guadalajara Dispensas

1684-1799 FHL Source Film 168662 - Mexico Genealogy

• 260 José de Meza & Catalina Araisa / Guadalajara

1636-1699 FHL Source Film 168357 - Mexico Genealogy

• 471 Antonio de Araiza (h.l. Antonio de Araiza & Micaela de Issae) & Bernarlda Cortez (h.l. Antonio Cortez & Melchora Tunado) / Ahualulco

The records that provide this information on Andres’s parents is found in the marriage dispensations:

Dispensa matrimonial de su hija Catalina con Antonio Orozco, Montejano Hilton, María de la Luz. Sagrada Mitra de Guadalajara, antiguo Obispado de la Nueva Galicia: expedientes de la série de matrimonios extractos siglos XVII-XVIII. Mexico: M. Montejano Hilton, 1999, pg. 26. 3 de junio de 1682

• Dispensa matrimonial de su hija Catalina con José de Meza y Cervantes, Montejano Hilton, María de la Luz. Sagrada Mitra de Guadalajara, antiguo Obispado de la Nueva Galicia: expedientes de la série de matrimonios extractos siglos XVII-XVIII. Mexico: M. Montejano Hilton, 1999, pg. 579. 11 de septiembre de 1697
• Dispensa matrimonial de su hijo Antonio, Montejano Hilton, María de la Luz. Sagrada Mitra de Guadalajara, antiguo Obispado de la Nueva Galicia: expedientes de la série de matrimonios extractos siglos XVII-XVIII. Mexico: M. Montejano Hilton, 1999, pg. 552. 12 de noviembre de 1699
• 
  
  I have a copy

Great job, rvs, that’s how I read it, though there are a couple I see differently, tell me what you think:

4. q[ue h]ay
10. de+ella ya con la m[erce]d
13. al s[eñ]or o[bi]spo
14. no [h]ay otra cosa
15. aviso a v[uestra] m[erced]

Might #2 be “conste”? When I read through, neither really makes sense to me! ;)

For abbreviations, I find this website very helpful: https://www.iifilologicas.unam.mx/dicabenovo/index.php?page=inicio

Saludos!
Manny Díez Hermosillo

Hi @alexfanatico, I am no expert but it seems to me like some of the words are the following:
1. Probanza
2. Conoce
3. Juzgaran
4. ** can't understand this one
5. Cosa faltare
6. Ser cosa tan
7. Tan remotas
8. Ser sus padres
9. Le sobra
10. De ella, ya con la mal * not 100% sure of "mal" as the last word
11. Proveyó 
12. Avisado
13. Al Santo Oficio or Sr. Oficial * not 100% sure
14. Hay Dicha Cosa * not 100% sure of "hay" as the first word.
15. Aviso ahí
16. ** can't understand this one
17. Su mujer __ __ conserve. ** can't make out two or three words of this part.

I hope it may be useful!
Best regards,



 

So, originally, the parish of Ayo el Chico (Ayotlán) encompassed most of what are now the municipios of Ayotlán, Arandas, Jesús María and Degollado. In the late 1700s the parish Ayo el Chico was split into two, Ayo el Chico and Arandas. Later, in about the 1820s or 1830s the parish of Arandas was split into two as well, Arandas and Jesús María (also known for a time as Barranca de Viudas).

I looked for El Carrizal in the 1825 padrón for Arandas and Jesús María. There are two places named El Carrizal: El Carrizal de Arriba and El Carrizal de Abajo. They are listed together in the padrón so it is very likely that they were located next to or close to each other. Based on the names of some of the other places that were listed along with the two Carrizales, and with the help of a somewhat recent municipal map of Arandas, it is likely that El Carrizal was located about here: 20°40'43.5"N 102°23'37.0"W. Similarly, El Chilarejo was possibly located here: 20°42'02.0"N 102°19'49.7"W.

So, as you suggested, El Carrizal (which translates to The Reedbed) is a common place name in the region. What is the name of the parish or town that your ancestors went to for their Sacraments? An old padrón for that location may provide some clues to the current location of the El Carrizal you are curious about.

Could not find a marriage record for Juan Estrada and Francisca Hernandes, but did find at least 4 children of theirs.

Mariano Estrada, Simona Estrada, Maria Matilde Estrada, and Claro Estrada.   Of these 4 children only Claro Estrada's baptism record was found. This record not only provided the names of his parents, Juan Estrada and Francisca Hernandes, but the names of his paternal/maternal grand-parents. In this record Juan's father was listed as Mariano Estrada and his mother as Luisa Reyes [Surname Ramires was stated in the death record]. Francisca's father was noted as Marcelino Hernandes and mother was Apolonia Medina (Surname in other records noted as Almansa).  The link for Claro's baptism record is listed below. 

https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:939J-4KS6-L?cc=1804458

Now that we know who the parents of Juan Estrada are, we begin looking for links for Mariano Estrada and wife Luisa Reyes/Ramires

Luckily one baptism record was found for Maria Epifania del Refugio Estrada

First of all welcome to the site!  The information you provided leaves very little to go on, but I will try to see if the Juan Estrada you have mentioned is from your family branch. My initial curiosity was in looking for any Juchipila "Estrada" family connections, which it does not appear there are any. 

The only Juan Estrada that died on 8 May 1863 in Zacatecas, Mexico is of Guadalupe, Zacatecas, Mexico, listed in Civil Records (See Link below). Juan Estrada was listed as a bricklayer, 32 years old, and it was stated within the death record that he was originally from San Joseph de Yslas, which is now Genaro Codina (Zacatecas). I believe early records are also found for this general area in Ojo Caliente (Zacatecas), Panuco (Zacatecas), and Calera Victor Rosales (Zacatecas).  Nearly all of these locations have incomplete genealogy records, so gathering information can be tough.  The death record also mentioned that Juan Estrada left a widow in Francisca Hernandes(z). The officials

Here you go: 

Francisco de Cobarrubias vecino destas minas parezco ante vuestra merced y digo que por informaciones y recaudos bastantes que en mi poder tengo tengo probado y averiguado ser como en efecto soy natural de la villa de cobarrubias en los Reinos de españa que es en la diocesis y obispado de burgos y hijo legitimo de martin de navarrete y de ysabel hernandez de logroño su legitima muger mis padres y de como fueron casados legitimamente segun orden de la santa madre yglesia de Roma y que durante este matrimonio ubieron por sus hijos legitimos a mi el dho francisco de cobarrubias y a pedro navarrete mi hermano

I, Francisco de Covarrubias, a resident of these mines, appear before your grace and I say that by sufficient information and records that I have in my possession, I have proven and ascertained that I am, as a matter of fact, a native of the town of Covarrubias in the Kingdoms of Spain, which is in the diocese and bishopric of Burgos, and the legitimate son of Martin de

I acquired this source from the Huntington Library. I just uploaded the entire document for you if you want it.

https://www.nuestrosranchos.org/node/34027

He says that he is from the town of Covarrubias in the kingdoms of Spain, that’s in the diocese and bishopric of Burgos; he is the legitimate son of Martin de Navarrete and of Isabel Hernandez de Logroño, who, during their marriage, gave birth to him and to his brother, Pedro Navarrete. In the second image, he says he’s married to Isabel de Rodas, daughter of Francisco Solano Calderon and Francisca Jimenez Altamirano, residents of Garciaz, tierra de Trujillo, in the kingdoms of Castilla (Garciaz, Caceres, Extremadura).

Saludos,

Manny Díez Hermosillo

Hello Dana and welcome to nuestrosranchos,

The answer is that my book isn’t published yet.  And the answer to your other question about the Ruiz de Esparza ancestry on familysearch is that most of what they put is straight out of what I wrote here.  But they have a big mistake as they put a wrong wife in The lineage.   The wifes are the ones that I have posted here on nuestrosranchos.

Good luck in your research,

Rick A. Ricci

3). Martin Ruiz de Esparza y Huici (Vici), señor del palacio de Esparza (Galar), vecino de Pamplona and Maria de Espinosa (Spinosa) are the parents of Lope Ruiz de Esparza.   On familysearch I see that they wrongly post Martins third wife as the mother of Lope Ruiz de Esparza  Sr.  The mistake that I had put in my previous post was when I added Mariano Gonzalez Leal’s mistake that Capitan Andres Ruiz de Esparza (b.1542) was a brother of Lope Ruiz de Esparza Jr.   He is related but  not a brother. 

Rick A. Ricci

Hi Everyone,

I read the recent comments regarding dietary customs and slaughtering rituals and want to share a link to research released in the 1990s by Schulamith Halevy. She researched Sephardic customs remaining in northern Mexico. If you scroll down to Chapter 4 of her paper, you will find a list of customs and rituals. If any of these customs are familiar to your family, please share with us. I'd also be curious to know what family branches the customs descend from and whether the families connect to my tree. Here's the link:

https://www.cs.tau.ac.il/%7Enachum/sch/AnusimMexico.pdf

I've heard this tale before, but only from small regions in central Mexico. It might be left over by migrating Spaniards from the areas in Southern Spain controlled over many centuries by the Moors and further influenced by the Sephardic populations residing there. 

For the most part, Mexico's past cuisine didn't lend itself to mixing pork with cheese...probably due to the ingredients, safety handling and the crude storage methods used long ago. Today's cuisine say...pork carnitas burrito a la wet with melted cheese, sauce and sour cream has put that notion to rest.

From what I've uncovered is that many of the early settlers from Spain to Mexico were from the northern region of Spain where pork is used abundantly and lard is almost always used as a cooking oil. This may explain why Mexico isn't really known for olive oil use as in other South American countries and olive oil is perceived as medicinal rather than for general cooking. 

As to why some Mexican habits, cuisine and myths may

I have never heard of this. I have heard of no pork, as someone else said. In my family we had a no blood rule. My mom grew up on a farm and her dad would always hang the animals upside down when slaughtering them for food by slicing them across the neck. All the blood had to drain into the ground before they could use the meat. When I asked my mom for the reason behind this, she said all she knew was that her father told her they should never eat the blood, because blood would make you sick. I know this is definitely not a widespread belief in Mexican culture, so I think it could reflect a Jewish influence. In that same vein (no pun intended!), on both sides of my family no egg is eaten without first inspecting it for any sign of blood. If there's even one spot, the whole egg gets thrown out. 

Hi David, 

It may be a far reaching custom derived from Jewish dietary law, except observant and some non-observant Jews to this day would NEVER eat pork.  As a matter of fact, they won’t even mention the word “pork”. 

You are correct that they will not mix dairy with beef. No cheeseburgers for them. 

Dietary laws are found in Leviticus 11 and Deuteronomy 14:21-22. 

Happy researching. 

Hi David, 

It may be a far reaching custom derived from Jewish dietary law, except observant and some non-observant Jews to this day would NEVER eat pork.  As a matter of fact, they won’t even mention the word “pork”. 

You are correct that they will not mix dairy with beef. No cheeseburgers for them. 

Dietary laws are found in Leviticus 11 and Deuteronomy 14:21-22. 

Happy researching.